Lee,
Wow, 70,000 acres of parks in Minneapolis is amazing! I had no idea the city had that much. I don't know what I thought the acreage is - perhaps 10,000. Bob ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lee Frelich" <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Monday, November 30, 2009 9:21:57 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: Re: [ENTS] Observing nature... Bob: Judging from the article about a single tree in Cambridge (which Harvard was going to cut down because it was judged a hazard tree) that appeared in The Boston Globe on the same page as the article about my earthworm research two years ago, I would say people in Boston take trees pretty seriously. Did I mention that in the Minneapolis Metro Area we have at least 70,000+ acres of parks, including three state parks and several regional parks that are 2,000-5,000 acres in size? This includes about 20 miles of Mississippi River frontage, 20 miles on the Minnesota River and 10s of miles of frontage on smaller rivers, 500 lakes greater than 10 acres in size (not counted in the acreage total), at least six natural areas (3 with unlogged sugar maple, oak and basswood forest, 2 with unlogged white pine forest, and 2 with prairie and savanna), and units like the 2600 acre Louisville Swamp, part of a national wildlife refuge, with large tracts of savanna, marsh, heron rookeries, dwarf oak forest and giant cottonwood forest. There is also the 900 acre Minnesota Landscape Arboretum which has a vast collection of garden plants that will grow in our climate as well as trees from around the world, arranged by taxa around a 3-mile loop. The parking lots of these places are usually full on weekends, but they are big enough that they don't feel crowded while hiking. Lee [email protected] wrote: > Lee, > > You've spoken convincingly about the Minneapolis citizenry's > appreciation for their trees and I am impressed by the demonstrations > of tree awareness. Maybe I judge the people I saw yesterday in the > Arboretum too seriously. It wouldn't be the first time I've done that > where tree awareness is concerned. > > Bob > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Lee Frelich" <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Sent: Sunday, November 29, 2009 9:57:20 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern > Subject: Re: [ENTS] Observing nature... > > Bob: > > Next time you are in Wisconsin, lets visit Concrete County Park. They > have hundreds of concrete animals--elephants, lions, deer, bear, > giraffes, etc., and a few concrete trees. They were made by an eccentric > man whose yard was made into a park after he died. No chance that they > will bite you either, although the local deer ticks an Lyme disease are > a concern. These concrete animals and trees in the park were the only > things left standing for miles in any direction after the great blowdown > of July 4th, 1977, which took out a swath of forest 15 miles wide by 150 > miles long with winds as high as 157 miles per hour--another one of our > Midwestern thunderstorms that are the eighth wonder of the world. > > Regarding trees, people jog right by the trees in Minneapolis too. But > if the city puts a dot of paint on one (various colors indicate > different diseases or problems with the tree, and that it might have to > be cut down), you should hear the calls that come in accusing the > forestry department of being tree killers. Whenever a tree is marked in > my neighborhood, or on campus, I get phone calls and e-mails about it, > but have become expert at redirecting peoples anger to the appropriate > department. Recent cases include a 20 foot tall white pine that was cut > down to install some underground utilities (this was announced a week in > advance, but that didn't help assuage the woman whose office window > looks out on the tree, which was the preferred perch for goldfinches and > purple finches), a green ash on campus that had emerald ash borer, and > several half dead trees on the greenway that are overtopped by other > trees because they were planted too close together. > > Lee > > Bob wrote: > > Jenny > > > > I have much the same reaction wherever I go in urban parks. > > People are so unattuned to the natural world. The natural features > > might as well he replaced by concrete replicas. Even when there are > > big trees, I find myself mumbling under my breath. Can't wait to get > > out of Boston. > > > > Bob > > > > Sent from my iPhone > > > > On Nov 29, 2009, at 3:18 AM, [email protected] > > <mailto:[email protected]> wrote: > > > >> Bob, Steve, Jess, Ed, > >> > >> Bob, welcome to my hell!!!! I have thought about these things so so > >> much while scouring the NYC parks to bond with the bit of nature on > >> offer. > >> > >> My reactions to people I encounter in these situations are pretty > >> much unfair and judgmental!! > >> > >> I don't understand people who study birds yet don't also take note of > >> the tree or other perching/habitat environment. But I have 'issues' > >> in general with "birders" mostly based on the lack of interest they > >> have in the birds themselves. Many are just list keepers, collectors, > >> like you were saying. I understand but I don't like it. On my > >> Colorado night migration workshop in September I was the only one > >> excited about the whole ecological experience as opposed to just the > >> birds. Weird. > >> > >> I can't believe people don't teach their kids general respect for > >> nature. Kids kick trees and try to kick birds - and I completely > >> understand them for doing it - but I don't understand their parents > >> for not stopping them. When I say something I talk directly to the > >> kid and say things in the nicest possible way, hopefully with humor. > >> And in that way, maybe a tiny bit of awareness will sink in. > >> > >> I know birds and trees are not human, but I could never treat them as > >> unfeeling beings - even the tree in its way, is sentient. > >> > >> I hate the Fordham students jogging through NYBG and I would hate > >> anyone jogging in the Arnold Arboretum. Exceptions are people running > >> with their big dogs who need a good run. But honestly, why not just > >> take a a strenuous hike? I bet they drove to the Arboretum anyway, > >> > >> As for them appreciating their surroundings by going to the Arboretum > >> to jog, I think they sure do appreciate the environment for > >> themselves but don't give a "care" about anybody elses' experience. > >> There are more than enough municipal parks for jogging. I think it's > >> offensive. When people jog through the NYBG forest, I think it's > >> really unnecessary and a little insulting to people that have paid to > >> enjoy the experience. Especially since the Bronx River Park is just > >> across the blvd. > >> > >> Fair or unfair, there you have it. It's the obliviousness of people > >> that absolutely torments me. Makes for some damn long unhappy days in > >> NYC, but I do my best.... > >> > >> Jenny > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> -----Original Message----- > >> From: Jess Riddle <[email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>> > >> To: [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > >> Sent: Sat, Nov 28, 2009 11:59 pm > >> Subject: Re: [ENTS] Observing nature... > >> > >> Steve, > >> > >> Interesting question. I don't know enough relevant information to > >> make come up with a good answer, but I'm not going to let that keep me > >> from speculating. > >> > >> Eyeballs help make an entity cute. Humans have many body parts in > >> common with other vertebrates, so its natural to anthropomorphize > >> animals. Anthropomorphizing could lead to an emotional connection. > >> Plants are more difficult to identify with, and hence less commonly > >> cared about. > >> > >> For motile animals, natural selection favors individuals that that pay > >> attention to movement in their environment. Hence, moving birds > >> naturally become the focus of human attention, while no analogous > >> process exists to draw our attention to an individual tree. > >> > >> I enjoy finding things: fossils, rare plants, and of course big trees. > >> I don't know how universally people enjoy searching (although Waldo > >> suggests I'm not alone), but birds seem like a convenient goal for > >> those who like searching. Birds exhibit patterns of behaviour > >> allowing the development of search strategies, and the birds present > >> at a given site changes daily. Once found, the behaviour can become > >> the focus of attention, which is not possible with plants (with a few > >> notable exceptions like carnivorous plants). > >> > >> Bob, > >> > >> All those people frustrating you could have chosen to walk at a track, > >> in a mall, or on a treadmill. However, they made the conscious > >> decision to go to the arboretum. That decision suggests to me that on > >> some level they do appreciate their surroundings. > >> > >> Jess > >> > >> On Sat, Nov 28, 2009 at 10:58 PM, Steve Galehouse > <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: > >> > ENTS- > >> > > >> > Today my oldest son and I returned to the Cuyahoga Valley to > investigate > >> > some sites for potential reports. We didn't spend much time > measuring, > >> > rather just hiked to explore unfamiliar areas(did measure a white > ash to > >> > 132', and a sycamore to 13' 10'' cbh and 113'). The neatest thing we > >> > observed was a snowy owl, perched in a tree in an area of larger > trees. It's > >> > very unusual for one to be in Ohio, but my trusty Peterson's > guide says it > >> > can happen---which brings me to the primary question of this > post: Why are > >> > more people, generally, interested in birding than observing and > measuring > >> > trees? I think we all can attest that on a trail we would more likely > >> > encounter a birder with a $800-$1200 Zeiss binocular around the > neck than a > >> > tree measurer with a $200 Nikon rangefinder and $100 > inclinometer. I'm in no > >> > way anti-birding, but knowing the woods seems so much more > basic--the types > >> > of trees determine the species of birds and mammals present. The > >> > avian-centric position seems to be expressed in the promotional > literature > >> > of park systems also, where rare or unusual species of birds > present are > >> > stressed, without mention of the forest community that attracted > them. And > >> > Jenny, this in no way is meant to disparage your rescue efforts > in NYC. > >> > > >> > Steve > >> > > >> > -- > >> > Eastern Native Tree Society http://www.nativetreesociety.org > >> > Send email to [email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]> > >> > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/entstrees?hl=en > >> > To unsubscribe send email to > [email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]> > >> > >> -- > >> Eastern Native Tree Society http://www.nativetreesociety.org > >> Send email to [email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]> > >> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/entstrees?hl=en > >> To unsubscribe send email to [email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]> > >> -- > >> Eastern Native Tree Society http://www.nativetreesociety.org > >> Send email to [email protected] > >> <mailto:[email protected]> > >> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/entstrees?hl=en > >> To unsubscribe send email to [email protected] > >> <mailto:[email protected]> > > -- > > Eastern Native Tree Society http://www.nativetreesociety.org > > Send email to [email protected] > > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/entstrees?hl=en > > To unsubscribe send email to [email protected] > > -- > Eastern Native Tree Society http://www.nativetreesociety.org > Send email to [email protected] > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/entstrees?hl=en > To unsubscribe send email to [email protected] > -- > Eastern Native Tree Society http://www.nativetreesociety.org > Send email to [email protected] > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/entstrees?hl=en > To unsubscribe send email to [email protected] -- Eastern Native Tree Society http://www.nativetreesociety.org Send email to [email protected] Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/entstrees?hl=en To unsubscribe send email to [email protected] -- Eastern Native Tree Society http://www.nativetreesociety.org Send email to [email protected] Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/entstrees?hl=en To unsubscribe send email to [email protected]
