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I'm not sure if the subject of my part of this discussion is good and bad mods or ones that make sense and ones that don't. I'm pointing toward the legalities of doing certain things, the modifications and the methods used to accomplish them. The clock/spar? It reminds me of the same thing, the "clock" example being one side of the fence that is as far away from the spar example as you can get, but a fraud - sorry, no! My point is that what is written as law, is law and it is done so for a reason. Do I agree with it? Well, most of the time, but the other most of the time I wonder why we must sit amidst 1940's technology with no apparent light at the end of the tunnel. I'm not an engineer, nor have I recently stayed in a Holiday Inn, so I don't think I'm qualified enough to make a decision whether to use a bolt from Home Depot or cut a hole in a part of the airplane that was designed to be structure in a manner that contradicts actual professional common practices. At this point in time I do not have the authority to determine whether or not a particular FAA ruling applies to everyone else but me. Perhaps old Saddam can get away with interpreting the laws the way he sees fit, but even then it caught up to him. And yes, if the speed limit in a school zone is 25 mph, at 26 mph you're in violation. Will you get a ticket? Probably not, but I know most sensible people will agree with me when I say that if you do receive a ticket, it is not a "fraud". Rules and regs are written for a reason. We're lucky enough to live in a country where we can attempt to change them if we like. Until they're changed, you must respect them and try to understand why they're in place. As far as those laws are concerned, installation of a clock without the proper paperwork is the same as a spar splice without any paperwork. In real life if either fail, one can get you killed, the other in a bit of trouble with the wife, which may be worse. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert Q. Steinman, PhD" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[email protected]> Sent: Friday, May 13, 2005 5:00 PM Subject: RE: [COUPERS-FLYIN] Paperwork ----[Please read http://ercoupers.com/disclaimer.htm before following any advice in this forum.]---- Your comment remind me of those who believe that zero tolerance makes good sense, when in fact zero tolerance means zero brains. There is no substitute for common sense. I would say the difference between a clock and a spar is fraud. Robert Q. Steinman, Ph.D. -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, May 13, 2005 4:43 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [COUPERS-FLYIN] Paperwork ----[Please read http://ercoupers.com/disclaimer.htm before following any advice in this forum.]---- Richard; That's grand fodder for a very good discussion. I'm surprised that your airplane can even get off the ground with a clock not certificated for the Ercoupe. ;-) But let's not go to those extremes. How about a wing spar that has been spliced together, no records or docs? Flies fine doesn't it? Wouldn't you like to know about it when you're buying? Has your own IA checked the seat belts for AD's? That's what an annual is all about! What about some mechanic changing a mag without documenting it? An AD comes along that you don't think affects you and it spits up (or in) chunks one day. Same goes about those unapproved fuel pump repair kits that are probably just as good ad the high priced spread. How do you know if the baggage compartment that's in there w/o paperwork will hold your pilot bag or fall through on top of the control cables? What about that bubble windshield without the paperwork? Was it really installed in the manner that was listed on the STC? There are many scenarios that could be valid as well as ridiculous. On one side have you ever heard about the guys putting MOPAR pistons in the C85's? Talk about hot rods! On the other is the clock. Have there been 40 years of bad mechanics? In a word, well - - - -! Good technicians obviously, but the job's not done until the paperwork is completed. Can an IA inspect the work performed previously and submit the paperwork. Absolutely, but unfortunately it'll be on your nickel. For too long these little airplanes have gotten minimal or pencil inspections, and in the very near future, after a few do fall out of the sky with Sport Pilots at the helm, the party is going to be over. Bottom line guys, my first airplane was a coupe as was my second, fourth and sixth (in restoration, now). The third and fifth were/are Bonanzas. Big difference in prices of everything, but I learned the value of a good inspection and proper documentation. Don't fall into a bad habit by sneaking one over on your IA. Get that documentation taken care of, it'll show pride in ownership and increase the value of that airplane. And NEVER buy an aircraft without a prebuy. Al Always willing to tell you what you don't expect to hear. Isn't that right, B? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Richard Wilkens" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Friday, May 13, 2005 4:08 PM Subject: [COUPERS-FLYIN] Paperwork ----[Please read http://ercoupers.com/disclaimer.htm before following any advice in this forum.]---- You know we haven't had lively discussion on this list in years, so let's start one. We just had a member use the following phase ".Too many Ercoupes have poor paperwork, undocumented mods." As many of you know I collect Ercoupe records and have probability read as many individual Ercoupe FAA airworthiness records as anyone. Take for example the clock in the middle of my panel, I think it was put there in 1965, but there is no 337 for it. Oh dear the world will come to an end! Our Leader will be unhappy! In the 17 years I have had my Coupe not a single AP has said anything about it. Does that mean the 16 annuals I have had were done by BAD APs? (That would mean ten out of ten APs I have used over the years are all bad. If we go back the full 40 years since the clock was put in, who knows how many bad APs have worked on my Coupe. That even includes Skyport--many years before John owned it.) When I flow 904 over an 11,000 foot pass with the ceiling low enough you couldn't see the top of the mountains, I didn't care that the clock doesn't have a 337 on file with the FAA. What I cared about is that my AP just finished an annual and 904 was running great with all gauges in the green. If I had put it into the mountain that day, do you think the FAA would have checked for the 337 on my clock? I have noticed reading FAA airworthiness files all one has to do is ask his current AP to check the installation of the "mods" and they will file a 337 for the "mod" saying "I have inspected the previously installed 'mod' and it was done in accordance with FAA rule XXXX.xxx." So what is the big deal? I don't think that because the FAA doesn't have a piece of paper on file makes an airplane something to worry about or "...pay scrap prices...". If you have bad paperwork and want scrap prices give me a call, I have money in the bank. I firmly agree with one letter I read in a FAA registration file. The guy was having a problem getting his registration done with the FAA. He wrote them saying something like "If you don't send me the registration, my airplane will fly just as well without it." Richard N99904 ========================================================================== == == To leave this forum go to: http://ercoupers.com/lists.htm Search the archives on http://escribe.com/aviation/coupers/ ========================================================================== == == To leave this forum go to: http://ercoupers.com/lists.htm Search the archives on http://escribe.com/aviation/coupers/ -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.11.9 - Release Date: 5/12/2005 _____ << ella for Spam Control >> has removed 99957 Spam messages and set aside 6479 Newsletters for me You can use it too - and it's FREE! HYPERLINK "http://www.ellaforspam.com"www.ellaforspam.com -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.11.9 - Release Date: 5/12/2005 ========================================================================== == == To leave this forum go to: http://ercoupers.com/lists.htm Search the archives on http://escribe.com/aviation/coupers/ ========================================================================== ==== To leave this forum go to: http://ercoupers.com/lists.htm Search the archives on http://escribe.com/aviation/coupers/
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