Yes, the severe problem is in hot climates. So much of Europe is not going to see the issue. Though some may. Put a charged Leaf in a garage on a rock in Greece or Spain, let it heat up good in the summer sun and you will see some deterioration like in AZ. Unless they have made some improvements.
Five year warranty on a pack is not really very good. If you get to 5 years, do they honor it further out to 60K? No, or they would just have a 60K warranty. So it is 5 years or less if one drives 60K. Here in the US 60k miles might use up $6000 in fuel on a similar size ICE car, less if the car is efficient. At ~60 miles to a charge, not much driving gets done, and a Leaf yields a poor payback against gas prices in the US if the battery pack makes trouble. If I had to buy a $5500 pack and some unknown labor every 5 years that would really suck. I expect cars to last 10+ years. According to my understanding of Li ion cells, it is possible to select cells, make packs and manage them for nearly unlimited life with no loss of capacity. You have to cool them, oversize them, undercharge them, and under discharge them. Not many EV manufacturers on that path yet. Here is hoping the new testing catches on and they all wise up. On Wed, Mar 25, 2015 at 11:34 AM, Jamie K via EV <[email protected]> wrote: > > On 3/25/15 3:03 AM, brucedp5 via EV wrote: > >> % Some U.S. Leaf owners would state differently % >> > > Yes, but to be fair it looks like the quoted articles are about Europe. > > AFAIK the US problem was primarily in hot climates in some earlier models. > It's been reported that the packs have been updated a few times since then. > 2013+ LEAF packs have a better reputation. > > Failures below spec are eligible for warranty replacement. Replacements > are with the so-called "Lizard" battery pack, which is reported to be more > tolerant of hotter climates. > > To outright purchase a replacement pack costs $5500 with trade-in of the > old pack, plus installation (and a necessary upgrade kit for earlier > 2011/2012 models which would add up to about $6k total). Warranty is 8 > years/100,000 miles against defects and 5 years/60,000 miles against > capacity loss. > > http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=17168&; > hilit=+battery+update#p374490 > > Cheers, > -Jamie > > > > https://3d-car-shows.com/nissan-leaf-battery-reliably- >> outperforms-cynics-critics-and-alternatives/ >> NISSAN LEAF BATTERY RELIABLY OUTPERFORMS CYNICS, CRITICS AND ALTERNATIVES >> March 23, 2015 By Gerald Ferreira >> >> [image >> https://3d-car-shows.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/nissan-leaf.jpg >> >> >> video >> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6V1bJJwJhEg >> Nissan LEAF Battery Reliability Outperforms Cynics, Critics and >> Alternatives >> Nissan Europe Mar 17, 2015 >> - Just 0.01% of batteries have been replaced since 2010 >> - More reliable than a petrol or diesel engine, according to industry >> averages >> >> § Nissan LEAF is the world’s best-selling electric car, with more than >> 30,000 sold across Europe >> ] >> >> - Five years on, Nissan reports 99.99% battery success rate across >> Europe >> >> - More reliable than a petrol or diesel engine, according to industry >> averages >> >> - Nissan LEAF is the world’s best-selling all-electric car, with over >> 165,000 sold globally >> >> Rolle, Switzerland, 19 February 2015: Five years and more than 35,000 >> European sales since the launch of its all-electric LEAF, proprietary data >> released by Nissan for the first time shows that 99.99 percent of its >> battery units remain entirely fit for purpose. >> >> The findings will silence naysayers who, in 2010, claimed that “batteries >> would need to be fully replaced after three years,” or that “high-mileage >> LEAFs would experience a noticeable drop in battery capacity in the first >> year of ownership.” >> >> In fact, the failure rate of the battery power unit is less than 0.01 >> percent – or just three units in total – a fraction of the equivalent >> industry-wide? figure for defects affecting traditional combustion >> engines. >> >> To prove the long-term reliability of the battery technology, Nissan >> tracked >> down a rather infamous early model, whose owner is still enjoying >> fault-free >> motoring in her LEAF three years on: >> >> Electric vehicle advocate and presenter of online TV channel Fully >> Charged, >> Robert Llewellyn commented: “This comes as no surprise. There was a lot of >> apprehension about electric technology in the beginning, but with sales >> climbing month-on-month I struggle to see how these myths continue to be >> regurgitated today.” >> >> The Nissan LEAF has smashed its own sales record with a 33 percent >> increase >> in sales in 2014 over the previous year, taking more than a quarter of the >> burgeoning electric car market with 15,098 sales. >> >> Jean-Pierre Diernaz, Director of Electric Vehicles for Nissan in Europe, >> comments: “The facts speak for themselves. The rate of battery faults in >> our >> vehicles is negligible, even the most ardent critic cannot argue with >> that. >> >> “The battery technology is just part of our success story. With over >> 165,000 >> customers globally, it’s clear that we’re not the only people who are >> thrilled by the success of this state-of-the-art technology.” >> >> With just three main components – the on-board charger, inverter and >> motor – >> the Nissan LEAF is also 40 percent cheaper to maintain compared to petrol >> or >> diesel-powered alternatives. >> >> The Nissan LEAF launched over four years ago in 2010, as one of the first >> mass-market, pure-electric vehicles. It is now the best-selling electric >> vehicle in history, with over 165,000 LEAF vehicles sold globally, more >> than >> 35,000 of which have been sold in Europe; clocking up an impressive one >> billion kilometres worldwide. >> [© 3d-car-shows.com] >> ... >> http://www.theautochannel.com/news/2015/03/23/127476-nissan- >> leaf-battery-reliably-outperforms-cynics-critics-and-alternatives.html >> Nissan LEAF Battery Reliably Outperforms Cynics, Critics and Alternatives >> 23 March 2015 >> >> >> >> http://www.sunderlandecho.com/news/business/nissan-sends- >> powerful-message-to-those-who-doubt-electric-vehicles-1-7171329 >> Nissan sends powerful message to those who doubt electric vehicles >> Fiona Thompson 23 March 2015 >> >> NISSAN’S Leaf batteries have shown they go the distance after less than >> 0.01 >> per cent of those installed in 35,000 cars have failed. >> >> Five years after the first models were built, data has shown 99.9per cent >> of >> the battery units made remain fit for purpose, with just three breaking >> during that time. >> >> It is said to be a fraction of the equivalent industry-wide figure for >> defects affecting traditional combustion engines. >> >> To prove their long-term reliability, Nissan tracked down the owner of the >> model which appeared in Top Gear’s test drive and electric vehicle >> advocate >> and presenter of online TV channel Fully Charged, Robert Llewellyn, who >> owns >> a Leaf. >> >> He said: “This comes as no surprise. >> >> “There was a lot of apprehension about electric technology in the >> beginning, >> but with sales climbing month-on-month I struggle to see how these myths >> continue to be regurgitated today.” >> >> Nissan says the Leaf has smashed its sales record with a 33 percent >> increase >> in 2014 over the previous year, taking more than a quarter of the market >> with 15,098 sales. >> >> Jean-Pierre Diernaz, director of electric vehicles for Nissan in Europe, >> said: “The facts speak for themselves. >> >> “The rate of battery faults in our vehicles is negligible, even the most >> ardent critic cannot argue with that. >> >> Nissan’s Sunderland plant produces the Qashqai, Note and Juke and the >> Leaf, >> with the production of lithium-ion batteries for electric vehicles >> starting >> in 2012. >> [© sunderlandecho.com] >> >> >> >> http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=220120 >> Tony Williams' updated battery capacity loss event chronology >> ... >> https://www.google.com/search?q=leaf+electric+car+battery+life+heat >> Leaf pack dies premature death in U.S. heat >> https://www.google.com/#q=nissan+leaf+electric+car+battery+life >> ... >> http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/template/ >> NamlServlet.jtp?macro=search_page&node=413529&query= >> subject%3Aevln+subject%3Aleaf+NOT+subject%3Are&days=0&sort=date >> Read more Leaf EVLN items on evdl >> >> >> >> >> For EVLN posts use: >> http://evdl.org/evln/ >> http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/template/ >> NamlServlet.jtp?macro=search_page&node=413529&query= >> subject%3Aevln+NOT+subject%3Are&days=0&sort=date >> >> >> {brucedp.150m.com} >> >> >> >> -- >> View this message in context: http://electric-vehicle- >> discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/EVLN-LEAF-EV-Pack- >> Reliability-Outperforms-Cynics-Critics-tp4674491.html >> Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at >> Nabble.com. >> _______________________________________________ >> UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub >> http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org >> For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/ >> group/NEDRA) >> >> > _______________________________________________ > UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub > http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org > For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/ > group/NEDRA) > > -- To invent, you need a good imagination and a pile of junk. Thomas A. Edison <http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/t/thomasaed125362.html> A public-opinion poll is no substitute for thought. *Warren Buffet* Michael E. Ross (919) 585-6737 Land (919) 576-0824 <https://www.google.com/voice/b/0?pli=1#phones> Google Phone (919) 631-1451 Cell [email protected] <[email protected]> -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20150325/76194d22/attachment.htm> _______________________________________________ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
