On Tuesday, January 6, 2026 at 5:45:01 AM UTC-7 John Clark wrote:
On Tue, Jan 6, 2026 at 5:21 AM Alan Grayson <[email protected]> wrote: *> can you succinctly explain why it implies local hidden variables don't exist? AG * *As I keep telling you, local hidden variables CAN exist, BUT NOT IF THINGS ARE REALISTIC AND DETERMINISTIC, you can't have all three. That's why the experimental finding that Bell's Inequality is violated has not ruled out objective collapse (my second favorite quantum interpretation), it's local and realistic but not deterministic, so Bell has not ruled it out. Many Worlds (my favorite) is local and deterministic but not realistic, so Bell has not ruled that out. Pilot Wave is realistic and deterministic but not local, so Bell has not ruled that out. As for Copenhagen, there is no consensus of what the hell it's saying so there is no consensus on whether Bell has ruled that out or not. And "shut up and calculate" has not been ruled out because it refuses to play the game. What has definitely been ruled out is our common sense ideas about how the world should work. * *Physicists agree with my statement, that Bell experiments show that local hidden variables do not exist. I am not clear how you reached your conclusion. Of course, if reality is realistic as Einstein thought, then hidden variables would exist, since in this case they're not hidden. Isn't the point of Bell experiments to show whether E's claim of realism is true? How could "objective collapse" be local? Isn't what you call objective collapse the Copenhagen interpretation? AG * -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/e4b495ed-ea9e-465d-a2a3-48fda97feba7n%40googlegroups.com.
