David Nyman wrote:
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> > Whoa dude.  That is some heavy-duty 'reality theory' speak ;)
>
> Yes indeedy. But my point is that qualia are an ontological category,
> not an epistemological one. This is crucial, because it entails that we
> can't *know* qualia, we can only instantiate them - *be* them. What we
> know - epistemology - is possible only in terms of the ontological
> categories that instantiate information, and qualia are examples of
> these categories that we personally instantiate, and in terms of which
> we 'know' seeing, tasting, touching, and all the rest. Consequently we
> cannot communicate such categories directly, but we can invite others
> to instantiate them - by communicating the necessary information - and
> consequently achieve commensurable dialogue by indicating the relevant
> parts of our personal instantiations.


I don't totally agree.  I think qualia have a dual-aspect: they are
*both* Ontological (the fabric of reality itself) *and* Epistemological
(the means through which reality is experienced).  See what I said in
the other thread: for the ontological categories which are universal in
scope (i.e the objectively real math concepts) I think there is *no*
difference between Cognitive categories and Metaphysical ones.  Math is
both the fabric of reality (metaphysics) *and* the means through which
reality is experienced and categorized (epistemology).

I wouldn't read much into the fact that humans can't communicate qualia
directly.  I see this as a limitation of the human mind rather than a
fundamental limitation.  The reason we're so horribly confused about
Qualia is that the human brain is not capable of consciously
representing mathematical concepts.  As regards mathematics we humans
are like someone suffering from 'blind-sight' : we can reason about
math indirectly in an abstract, intellectual sense (we can have
abstract mathematical knowledge), but we humans have no direct
*conscious* representations of mathematical concepts.

This is why I keep pointing out my theory that phenomal properties are
identical to mathematical properties.  The fact that the human mind
cannot consiously represent mathematical concepts is the source of all
our confusion. I maintain that a mind which *could* directly represent
mathematical concepts in its consciousness would no longer be confused
about Qualia in the slightest.


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