On Sunday, September 16, 2012 12:13:57 PM UTC-4, Stephen Paul King wrote:
>
>  On 9/16/2012 8:42 AM, Craig Weinberg wrote:
>  
>
>
> On Saturday, September 15, 2012 6:21:14 AM UTC-4, stathisp wrote: 
>
>   
>
>> Moreover, this 
>> set has subsets, and we can limit our discussion to these subsets. For 
>> example, if we are interested only in mass, we can simulate a human 
>> perfectly using the right number of rocks. Even someone who believes 
>> in an immortal soul would agree with this. 
>>
>
> No, I don't agree with it at all. You are eating the menu. A quantity of 
> mass doesn't simulate anything except in your mind. Mass is a normative 
> abstraction which we apply in comparing physical bodies with each other. To 
> reduce a human being to a physical body is not a simulation is it only 
> weighing a bag of organic molecules.
>  
>
>     Thus we can realistically claim that the physical world is exactly and 
> only all things that we (as we truly are) have in common. What must be 
> understood is that as the number of participating entities increase to 
> infinity, the number of "things in common" goes to zero. Only for a large 
> but finite set of entities will there be a semi-large number of relations 
> that the entities have in common and not have a degeneracy relation between 
> them.
>

That's exactly the backbone equivalence of multisense realism. As the most 
common denominators, the characteristics of quanta are the most impersonal 
and common forms of qualia. Because of the privacy of qualia, it really 
drains almost everything out of it to make it shared to the point of near 
universality. Qualia drained of most quality is really involuted qualia, 
but because it has no existence of its own, it doesn't commute the other 
way around. Qualia isn't involuted quanta, as quanta isn't anything without 
first being qualia. 

Both logical algebras and topologies are quanta. They are reductions of 
qualia, not particles or qualia-free informaiton which generate qualia. An 
mp3 file is a compression, not of music, but of the articulations of 
current which matches the acoustic dynamic conditions associated with sound 
perception. We can intellectually match the data of the mp3 file with any 
external topology (eardrum, needle on vinyl, speaker, laser pits on a CD, 
etc), and the logical algebra which (figuratively) animates that topology ( 
f(mp3)), but they only relate to each other, and not any kind of subjective 
experience. 


>     A black Hole is a nice demonstration of the degeneracy idea. The 
> effect of gravity is the force of degeneracy, when all the ground states 
> are forces to normalize and become identical with each other, the "space" 
> and "delay" (time) that is different between them collapses to zero and 
> thus we get singularity in the limit of the degeneracy.
>

That's cool. I can see that in my terms too, with gravity being like 
Kryptonite to motive participation. Systems lose their ability to 
differentiate themselves from a large mass.

Craig

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