On Mon, Sep 17, 2012 at 7:03 PM, Craig Weinberg <whatsons...@gmail.com>wrote:

>
>
> On Monday, September 17, 2012 6:18:00 PM UTC-4, Jason wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> Craig,
>>
>> Do you think if your brain were cut in half, but then perfectly put back
>> together that you would still be conscious in the same way?
>>
>
> There is no such thing as perfectly put back together. If you cut a living
> cell in half, it dies. The only way of putting it perfectly back together
> is to travel back in time and not cut it in half.
>

Why do you believe this?  We can put machines back together.  Cells are
machines on a very small scale.  It would be difficult, but there is no
physical reason that prevents us from putting a cell back together after it
has come apart.


>
>
>>
>> What if cut into a thousand pieces and put back together perfectly?
>>
>
> Same answer.
>
>
>>
>> What if every atom was taken apart and put back together?
>>
>
> If you could take every atom in a living cell 'apart' and put it back
> together without killing the cell, then it seems like it would work, but I
> don't think that the cells would necessarily be 'the same' cells.
>

What is different about them?  They could have the same exact quantum
state, and yet you believe that because at one point in the past some atoms
had some distance put between, and this somehow rules out the possibility
of those atoms ever being used to build a person or life form, or be
conscious?

Why would this be?  Our bodies continually take in and use atoms from
things that were once not alive.  What is different here?


> To me consciousness is an event in time, not a structure in space. The
> structure is the vehicle of the event. If you mess with the vehicle, you
> mess with the event.
>

What the difference between putting someone back together and a baby slowly
being constructed through a set of complex chemical reactions from
previously lifeless matter?  In either case would the result not be a fully
alive and conscious human?  Do you suppose life also requires that life
forms be built in certain natural ways (rather than artificial ways)?


>
>
>>
>> What if every atom was taken apart, and then atoms from a different pile
>> were used to put you back together?
>>
>
> When the atoms are taken apart, you die. If you put them together in what
> you think is the same way,
>
it is still a different performance of atoms, whether they are the same or
> different.
>
>

The hypothetical did not involve some person thinking they were put back in
the same way, but the atoms actually being put back in the same way.

Do you still think there would be a "different performance of atoms"?


>
>> What then if the original atoms were put back, would they both experience
>> what it is like to be you?
>>
>
> No.
>

Why shouldn't they?


>
>
>>
>> Does the identity of one's atoms matter or are they interchangable?  If
>> the identity is not what matters, what is it that does?
>>
>
> Our atoms are replaced all the time.
>

Right.


> Our identity exists at the level of our experience as a whole.
>

I don't understand what you mean here.


> The experience of our body, our family, culture, etc. We are a lifetime
> that uses the whole brain as a way to participate in the human world as a
> human body.
>

Are you suggesting that things beyond one's skull are relevant to what
someone experiences?

Jason



> Experience is what matters.
>
> Craig
>
>
>>
>> Jason
>>
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