On 10/5/2012 4:56 PM, Jason Resch wrote:



On Fri, Oct 5, 2012 at 1:32 PM, meekerdb <meeke...@verizon.net <mailto:meeke...@verizon.net>> wrote:

    On 10/5/2012 2:04 AM, Alberto G. Corona wrote:
    Dear john:

    2012/10/4 John Clark <johnkcl...@gmail.com <mailto:johnkcl...@gmail.com>>

         Alberto G. Corona <agocor...@gmail.com <mailto:agocor...@gmail.com>> 
Wrote:

                >> Mother Nature (Evolution) is a slow and stupid tinkerer, it 
had over
                3 billion years to work on the problem but it couldn't even 
come up
                with a macroscopic part that could rotate in 360 degrees!


            > First of all, 360 degrees rotation is present in the flagela of 
the
            bacteria, invented about 3800 million years ago


        I know, that's why I said "macroscopic". It's easy to make if the wheel 
is
        microscopic because nutriments can just diffuse in and waste products 
diffuse
        out; but as parts get bigger the volume increases by the cube of the 
radius but
        the surface area only increases by the square, so when things get big 
diffusion
        just isn't good enough. Evolution never figured out how to do better 
and make a
        wheel large enough to see, but people did.


     I explained in a post above why evolution does not select  weels. An 
autonomous
    living being must be topologically connected, and weels are not. This is a 
neat
    consequence of the need of repairability. No autonomous robot with weels 
can work
    for long time without supoort.. This is explained in detail somewhere above.

    I can imagine a design in which wheels are connected to the circulatory 
system just
    as some vehicles are built with hydraulic motors in their wheels.  Or the 
wheels
    might be separate organisms in a symbiotic relation.  Those are possible - 
but it's
    too hard to get there from here.  So you make the point yourself, evolution 
is
    constrained in ways that rational design is not.



Do we know that imagination doesn't use an evolutionary process (behind the scenes) to come up with new ideas? Could it be that our brains use evolutionary techniques, combining different things we know in random ways and running internal testing and selection of those ideas, before they bubble up into an Ah-Ha moment that we become conscious of?

Do we have any reason to believe ideas reproduce with variation and then those that reproduce most successfully rise to consciousness? THAT would be a Darwinian theory of consciousness.

Brent

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