Cool Roger,

It mostly makes sense to me, except I don't understand why I. is associated 
with objects and substance when it is feeling, perception, and first person 
quale.

To me, thinking is just as much first person as feeling, and they both are 
subjective qualia. Thinking is a meta-quale of feeling (which is a 
meta-quale of awareness>perception>sensation>sense)

That puts the whole subjective enchilada as Firstness and leaves objects 
and substance to Secondness. This is Self-Body distinction. What you have 
is like Lower-Self/Higher-Self distinction but with objects kind of 
shoehorned in there. Once you see matter as a public extension and self as 
a private intention, then Thirdness arises as the spatiotemporal 
interaction of formation and information.

That outlines one way of slicing the pizza. I don't know if you can see 
this but here:

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-Xz8OmKGPEjE/UIL6EtVeBEI/AAAAAAAAAZ4/iBhuMxBj9oU/s1600/trio_sml_entropy.jpg

That gives a better idea of the syzygy effect of the big picture, how they 
overlap in different ways and set each other off in a multi-sense way.

The Firstness, Secondness, and Thirdness relate respectively to the 
respective trios:

*I. Sense, Motive
II. Matter, Energy,
III. Space, Time*

to get to morality, you have to look at the black and white:

*IV. Signal *(escalating significance), *Entropy* aka Ent ntr rop opy 
(attenuating significance...fragmentation and redundancy obstructs 
discernment capacities...information entropy generates thermodynamic 
entropy through sense participation)

I did a post on this today, but it's pretty intense: 
http://s33light.org/post/33951454539

Craig


On Thursday, October 18, 2012 9:18:50 PM UTC-4, rclough wrote:
>
>  
> <https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-Xz8OmKGPEjE/UIL6EtVeBEI/AAAAAAAAAZ4/iBhuMxBj9oU/s1600/trio_sml_entropy.jpg>
> Hi Craig
>  
> Thanks very much for your comments Craig. I still need to digest them.
> Meanwhile, a flood of new ideas came to me and I just want to set them 
> down.
> There are no doubt mistakes, esp. with regard to subjective/objective.  
>  
>
> The Peirce-Leibniz triads Ver.2
>  
> I Firstness      object                substance       perception 
> (quale)   aesthetics      beauty        1st person       feeling      
> subjective    
>  
> II Secondness sign                  monad            
> thought                  logic               truth           2nd person     
> thinking     subj/obj      
>         
> III Thirdness   interprant     supreme monad   expression              
> morality        goodness       3rd person       doing       objective  
>  
>  
>   
>  ------------------------------
>
>
>
> It appears that Peirce's three categories match the Leibniz monadic 
> structures 
>
>
> as follows: 
>
> I. = object = Leibniz substance = quale 
>
> II. Secondness = sign = monad representing that substance. 
>     In Peirce, the sign is a word for the experience of that object . 
>     In Leibniz, the monads are mental, which I think means subjective. 
>
> III. Thirdness = interprant (meaning of I and II ) = by the monad of monads. 
>
>
> In addition to this, Peirce says that his categories are "predicates of 
> predicates", 
>
> where the first predicate (dog) is extensive and the second predicate (brown) 
> is intensive. 
>
> then the overall object might be animal-->dog-->brown. 
> Leibniz says that a monad is a complete concept, meaning all of the possible 
>
> predicates. 
>
> I suggest that the first or extensive predicate (dog) is objective  
> and the second predicate (brown) is qualitative or subjective. 
> So that the object as per ceived is a quale or Firstness. 
>
>
>
> Roger Clough, rcl...@verizon.net <javascript:>  
> 10/18/2012  
> "Forever is a long time, especially near the end." -Woody Allen 
>
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