On Wednesday, February 20, 2013 11:30:49 AM UTC-5, John Clark wrote:
> Miguel Nicolelis <http://www.nicolelislab.net/>
> > You could have all the computer chips ever in the world and you won’t 
>> create a consciousness.
> It must be grand being a "hard problem" theorist because it's the easiest 
> job in the world bar none, no matter how smart something is you just say 
> "yeah but it's not conscious" and there is no way anybody can prove you 
> wrong.

It's not that easy because people don't understand the hard problem and 
keep trying to pretend that it doesn't exist just because they can't solve 

> >computers will never replicate the human brain and that the technological 
>> Singularity is "a bunch of hot air. The brain is not computable and no 
>> engineering can reproduce it,"
> Unless you're willing to get on the mystical bullshit train (and even in 
> the 21'st century many are all too willing to get on that broken down old 
> choo choo) then the only conclusion to make is that the neural wiring 
> required to develop human level intelligence CANNOT be impossibly complex 
> because in the entire human genome there are only 3 billion base pairs. 
> There are 4 bases so each base can represent 2 bits and there are 8 bits 
> per byte so that comes out to just 750 meg, and that's enough assembly 
> instructions to make not just a brain and all its wiring but a entire human 
> baby. So the instructions MUST contain wiring instructions such as "wire 
> the neurons up this that and the other way and then repeat that procedure 
> 917 billion times.

No, it probably doesn't work that way at all. You are looking in the TV set 
to find which wires make the TV shows.

> And there is a huge amount of redundancy in the human genome, if you used 
> a file compression program like ZIP on that 750 meg you could easily put 
> the entire thing on half a CD, not a DVD not a Blu ray just a old fashioned 
> vanilla CD.
> > human consciousness (and if you believe in it, the soul) simply can’t be 
>> replicated in silicon. That’s because its most important features are the 
>> result of unpredictable, non-linear interactions amongst billions of cells
> Unpredictability and non-linear reactions are a dime a dozen but are more 
> the defining attribute of insanity than intelligence or the feeling of 
> personal identity that persists over decades; and besides, computers have 
> no trouble being unpredictable and non-linear. The first program I ever 
> wrote was to zoom in and look at small parts of the infinite Mandelbrot set 
> in detail, and even though I wrote the program if I wanted to know what the 
> image it would produce next would look like all I could do is wait and see 
> what sort of picture the program would create.

I agree with you there, it's not the unpredictability that is the issue. 
The unpredictability is a symptom of the sentience expressed through the 

> > You can’t predict whether the stock market will go up or down because 
>> you can’t compute it
> But it would be easy to write a program that goes up and down in such a 
> way that it passes the exact same statistical tests for randomness that the 
> real stock market does. So yes, it would be easier to make a intelligent 
> computer than it would be to make a intelligent computer that also happens 
> to be John K Clark or any other specific individual.

He's just giving a layman's example of how not everything can be reproduced 

> > the human brain has evolved to take the external world—our surroundings 
>> and the tools we use—and create representations of them in our neural 
>> pathways.
> And those neural pathways have started to understand how they work and has 
> devised technology to produce intelligent behavior without biological 
> neurons.

I think he's wrong there. There are no representations of our experiences 
in our neural pathways. Pointers maybe. 


>   John K Clark

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