On Friday, March 15, 2013 8:16:37 PM UTC-4, Alberto G.Corona wrote:
>
> Again the shorcomings of nominamism/positivism. The greeks would laugh at 
> these questions. It can be explained if we abandon the monomaniatic 
> reductionistic physicalism and think in terms of just what we are: rational 
> beings:
>
> I think that the notion of "lost control of something" in an intelligent 
> being -who think about future events in order to plan adequate actions in 
> advance- means that he can no longer preview what will happen next, so he 
> has no advanced plans, se has no control of the situation.
>

I think that's a big part of it. There is still a tangible reality that I 
think is beneath the planning of adequate actions which has to do with an 
expectation of maintaining effectiveness as a participant. To have 
attention deficit disorder or poor impulse control are like private and 
public versions of the same thing - an unwillingness or inability to engage 
one's will and ability. We say things like 'get a grip' or 'I can handle 
it' - the metaphor points to manual control, the hand as means for 
directing our influence over nature. Of course, this is all completely over 
the head of reductionist physics. Control, huh? influence over nature, wha?


Craig
 

>
> "Serious consequences" : The mind uses analogies and semantic to compress 
> information storage and communication. Serious means hard, severe, 
> important, not to be dismissed. Applied to consequences, it means that it 
> will be important to make plans to avoid them
>
>
> 2013/3/15 Craig Weinberg <whats...@gmail.com <javascript:>>
>
>>
>>
>> On Friday, March 15, 2013 2:06:50 PM UTC-4, yanniru wrote:
>>>
>>> Apparently the legacy view negates free will. 
>>>
>>
>> I think it does in many people's minds - or it would if they took their 
>> own beliefs seriously.
>>
>> Craig
>>  
>>
>>>  
>>> On Fri, Mar 15, 2013 at 2:00 PM, Craig Weinberg <whats...@gmail.com> 
>>> wrote: 
>>> > What does it mean to 'lose control' of something? 
>>> > 
>>> > Your car, your bladder, your gambling, your pet Rottweiler... 
>>> > 
>>> > What are the broad physical principles involved? What are we talking 
>>> about 
>>> > when we refer to this, and why is it something that can have 
>>> consequences 
>>> > considered to be 'serious'? 
>>> > 
>>> > It would seem that the legacy view is to simply deny that this phrase 
>>> refers 
>>> > to anything in particular. All processes are simply probabilistic 
>>> exchanges 
>>> > and clockwork mechanisms which are not 'controlled' by anything in 
>>> > particular to begin with. 
>>> > 
>>> > Craig 
>>> > 
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>
>
>
> -- 
> Alberto. 
>

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