Much thanks, Dr. Marchal.

Mitch



-----Original Message-----
From: Bruno Marchal <marc...@ulb.ac.be>
To: everything-list <everything-list@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Wed, Jun 26, 2013 9:30 am
Subject: Re: Why do you folks keep having conferences about consciousness ? 
Because you have erased the subject, And Cs. = subject + object


Hi spudboy,


Oops I miss this post, sorry.


On 23 Jun 2013, at 21:31, spudboy...@aol.com wrote:


That last phrase, Dr. Marchal is very difficult to grasp. 

Others are there, but "out there" is not out there.




Consider that you are dreaming. In the dream you see the sea, and the sky, and 
some clouds, and you think that those things are out there. But there is a 
clear sense that they are not "out there" OK? When you wake up, you realize it 
was, in some sense, all in your head.


With comp, this is generalized in some way. There is only the true arithmetical 
propositions, like "the machine i output j to the machine k after n steps of 
the machine g", for example. 


By the FPI, the consciousness flux differentiates on all arithmetical 
realization supporting your current life scenario, and apparently some of those 
dreams can be shared by collection of machines. But despite this, what truly 
is, is just the number theoretical truth. We can't see that because we are 
dreamed by them, and like in the dream above, we see many things outside us, 
but that notion of "outside us" is part of the dream. 


It is like in "Matrix", except that there is a superposition (by the FPI) of 
infinitely many matrices, and they interfere below our substitution level.


I hope this can help, I am currently explaining the math on the FOAR list, in 
case you are interested.


Bruno













Bruno




-----Original Message-----
From: Bruno Marchal <marc...@ulb.ac.be>
To: everything-list <everything-list@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Sun, Jun 23, 2013 8:39 am
Subject: Re: Why do you folks keep having conferences about consciousness ? 
Because you have erased the subject, And Cs. = subject + object




On 23 Jun 2013, at 04:29, spudboy...@aol.com wrote:


I read Sarfatti's website, Stardrive.org, too, and I am not sure he does the 
Leibniz idealism as you do. He seems more attuned to whether the future, or 
future beings from the distant future, try to influence their past. He doesn't 
claim its people or our descendants, just that information is being written to 
the present. Which in itself is a mind bending concept. 
 
Beyond Sarfatti, is the question of Len Susskind's Boltzmann Brains. The 
physics described forced the creation of observers via temperature 
differentials, somehow, as the universe expanded. This somehow created 
observers, which sprang up out of no where, but had defined memories of the 
past and identities. It somehow reminds me of the monads you speak of, and 
because it is so jolly, science fictional, it appeals to me. Because my mind 
works this way, I have wondered if God was a Boltzmann Brain of sorts, 
mysterious, intelligent, etc, but was created with the Big Bang. Perhaps 
external to the Big Bang was something He did himself, and manifests now as a 
Boltzmann Brain? I also wonder if others are out there? 



Boltzann brain are relatively rare, and it is unclear how they are related to 
the universal system running it. 
But if you agree with 2+2 = 4, it is only a tedious long, and not so easy, yet 
standard, exercise to prove the existence of infinitely many Boltzmann brain 
and (all) other universal numbers in arithmetic, together with all finite 
initial segment of computations. We are distributed in there, and what you call 
"physical reality" has to emerge naturally from the statistical view from 
inside. 
Boltzmann brain, as physical object are still Aristotelian chimer, based on 
brain-mind identity thesis.  All physical brains, notably, are the result of 
the statistical and arithmetical interference of all computations.


I don't know if what is true, but that is testable, with a spectrum of variant 
according to the axiomatic of knowledge chosen.


Others are there, but "out there" is not out there.


Bruno








 
Mitch


-----Original Message-----
From: Roger Clough <rclo...@verizon.net>
To: JACK SARFATTI <adast...@me.com>
Sent: Sat, Jun 22, 2013 6:31 am
Subject: Why do you folks keep having conferences about consciousness ? Because 
you have erased the subject, And Cs. = subject + object


Hi JACK SARFATTI  

onsciousness = subject + object = subjective world + objective world
Nice physics, very erudite, but If there's no subject, then 
here's no consciousness.  But if you include a subject, the consciousness
roblem is trivial. You don't to keep having conferences about the
mystery" of consciousness. It's only a mystery if you have lweft the
ubject out of the picture.
Like it or not , Idealism is the only philosophy that takes mind seriously,
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Idealism
and Leibniz was the only philosopher to rationally solve
he mind/body problem. It's only the "hard problem"
f, like Chalmers, you are a meterialist and
ubjectivity is not in your vocabulary.

 

r. Roger B Clough NIST (ret.) [1/1/2000]
ee my Leibniz site at
ttp://independent.academia.edu/RogerClough

---- Receiving the following content -----  
rom:  JACK SARFATTI  
eceiver:  Kim Burrafato  
ime: 2013-06-21, 23:17:54 
ubject: Fwd: [1306.4853] Relativistic Quantum Communication 


"In this Ph.D. thesis, I investigate the communication abilities of 
on-inertial observers 
and the precision to which they can measure parametrized states. I introduce 
elativistic 
quantum field theory with field quantisation, and the definition and 
ransformations of 
mode functions in Minkowski, Schwarzschild and Rindler spaces. I introduce 
nformation 
theory by discussing the nature of information, defining the entropic 
nformation 
measures, and highlighting the differences between classical and quantum 
nformation. I 
review the field of relativistic quantum information. We investigate the 
ommunication 
abilities of an inertial observer to a relativistic observer hovering above a 
chwarzschild 
black hole, using the Rindler approximation." 
 
 
 
Begin forwarded message: 
 
> From: Kim Burrafato  
> Subject: [1306.4853] Relativistic Quantum Communication 
> Date: June 21, 2013 7:03:52 PM PDT 
> To: Jack Sarfatti  
>  
> http://arxiv.org/abs/1306.4853 
>  
>  
 

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