Bruno, could you kindly tell me how could I find a universal machine? (No joke). I would LOVE to listen to them. John M
On Wed, Nov 6, 2013 at 6:20 PM, Bruno Marchal <marc...@ulb.ac.be> wrote: > > On 06 Nov 2013, at 21:31, John Mikes wrote: > > Bruno wrote No.6: > *You have missed the discovery of the universal machine. * > Was it a discovery, or an invention? Is there O N E *discovered*machine > for studying, or we just imagine how it should behave? > > > There are many universal machine, or universal number, but they are all > equivalent (and maximal) in computability and emulability abilities. > They are not equivalent in provability and inductive inference abilities, > although the correct one will obeys to very general mathematical laws. In > fact they all have the same (rich) theologies, and they are testable as the > theology contains the physics. > > So it is fun to listen to them, and compare with what we can observe. > > Bruno > > > > > > > On Wed, Nov 6, 2013 at 10:27 AM, Bruno Marchal <marc...@ulb.ac.be> wrote: > >> >> On 06 Nov 2013, at 13:48, Roger Clough wrote: >> >> Computers, code and consciousness >>> >>> Cumputers cannot simulate human activities or experiences >>> or consciousness because they have to deal in code. >>> >>> Code is not magic, have no inherent intelligence. >>> Computers are not magic, they are just machines. >>> >> >> Magic explains even less. >> Then, the closure of the computable functions for diagonalization >> introduces the "magic" of self-reference, in the different points of view. >> >> >> >> >> >>> Computers can only deal in code, which is impersonal and >>> public. They are noit experiences, but can be descruiptions >>> of experiences, which is not the same thing. >>> Unfortunately, experiences are >>> personal and computers, dealing in code only, >>> have no access to them. >>> >> >> They have access to their own code, but they are confronted to Truth, >> also. They have the same difficulty than us to relate truth and code. >> >> >> >> >> >>> Why must I keep explaining this ? >>> >> >> You have missed the discovery of the universal machine. That changes >> everything. The universal machine have a rich theology. >> >> >> >>> Computers deal in code. >>> >> >> At some level. Humans too. Cf DNA. >> >> People don't >>> >> >> At some level. Machines too (cf the machine's first person). >> >> If you need to introduce magic, it means you want escape reason, but this >> can only lead to bad faith, wishful thinking, etc. >> Computer science shows that there is enough "magic" in reason. No need to >> introduce it, as this addition might hide the magic which is there. >> Also, your way of reasoning is invalid? If human can use magic to be >> conscious, why not machine? You might be underestimating God's power. >> >> Bruno >> >> >> >> >> >>> Dr. Roger B Clough NIST (ret.) [1/1/2000] >>> See my Leibniz site at >>> http://independent.academia.edu/RogerClough >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "Everything List" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>> an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>> To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. >>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. >>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. >>> >> >> http://iridia.ulb.ac.be/~marchal/ >> >> >> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Everything List" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >> To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. >> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. >> > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > > > http://iridia.ulb.ac.be/~marchal/ > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. 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