Chris: you said it. I did not refer to "hydraulic fracturing' or "injecting (anything) INTO THE ROCK". I am talking about EXTRACTING H E A T only, in a CLOSED system. The carrying water must not touch the surrounding 'reservoir', must stay inside the well-system, in which it heats up for ascending to the surface. There is NO 'second well, the process goes in ONE. In and out. Your last par explains exactly the difference. Accordingly the ascending steam is NOT corrosive, the reason for using highly de-ionized (ultra-pure) water to inject into the hot zone INSIDE THE DEVICE.
On Sat, Nov 16, 2013 at 6:16 PM, Chris de Morsella <cdemorse...@yahoo.com>wrote: > John – The term reservoir has a well understood usage, when speaking about > hydraulic fracturing, to describe the engineered rock volume that is filled > by micro-fissures, created by injecting water under immense pressure into > the rock, at the well head. > > The injected slurry contains poppants. Poppants are either sand or > engineered small ceramic beads. It is this gritty material that maintains > the micro-fissures and allows for the creation of a three dimensional > volume – i.e. the reservoir – in which water can be injected and absorb > heat from the rock volume that has been exposed – a much vaster surface > area – by the hydraulic fracking. > > I am using the term reservoir very correctly – in the terms that it is > used when speaking of hydraulic fracturing. Eventually the engineered rock > volume that has been created by this process of fracking begins to reseal > (the overburden is immense and squeezes the micro-fissures shut over time). > In addition the engineered reservoir – in the specific sense that this term > is used when speaking about hydraulic fracturing – will over time become > depleted as heat is removed from it. Eventually that volume of rock will > get hot again, but by the time it does the engineered micro-fissures will > have been squeezed shut and the reservoir will have to be re-fracked. > > Water is injected into this reservoir, where it is turned into hot high > pressure steam that comes up the second well. This steam is far too > corrosive laden with minerals to use directly and must instead be used to > boil the actual water, whose high pressure steam will transfer energy into > the spinning turbine. If you used the steam from the well head you would be > replacing turbines every year or two. > > Chris > > > > *From:* everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto: > everything-list@googlegroups.com] *On Behalf Of *John Mikes > *Sent:* Saturday, November 16, 2013 2:49 PM > > *To:* everything-list@googlegroups.com > *Subject:* Re: Our Demon-Haunted World > > > > Chris: if you utter "reservoir" - you are on the wrong track. Nothing must > "COME OUT" from the depth. > > Not even what YOU pumped in into open plenum. (My objection against the NZ > plant). > > In Hungary in the 1950s a 'hot spring well' was tried to bring out 'heat' > by its own pressure. By the time > > it reached the surface cooling a bit (and expanded(!) from the pressure) > the M U D solidified into a hot mass. There was no private enterprise in > commi Hungary at that time, so the idea was scrapped. > > John M > > > > On Sat, Nov 16, 2013 at 3:51 PM, Chris de Morsella <cdemorse...@yahoo.com> > wrote: > > > > > > *From:* everything-list@googlegroups.com [mailto: > everything-list@googlegroups.com] *On Behalf Of *John Mikes > *Sent:* Saturday, November 16, 2013 12:33 PM > > > *To:* everything-list@googlegroups.com > *Subject:* Re: Our Demon-Haunted World > > > > Telmo: > > unfortunately I reflected to the NZ solution on another list... - it is a > convoluted - I could say: > > inadeqyate - technology, just as the Au version of the surface > utilization. > > SOME PARTS OF THE WORLD??? let us say: the surface? > > Solar woulrd cover immense surfaces just for supplying the energy as > needed TODAY and we > > will need a multiple of that soon... See my remark to Russell. > > So far NOBODY was interested in my suggestions: ewverybody blows his OWN > pipe. > > Geotherm is under our feet - dry lamd or oceans. Pipes are stuck down for > OIL, similar - if a bit > > longer for geothermic energy extraction with 2 pipes inserted: ONE for > pumping DOWN the > > ultrapure (Si-free) water into a heat-exchanger at ~140+C environment, the > OTHER to ascend > > the high pressure steam straight into the turbine. No deposit, as in NZ. > > JOhn Mikes > > > > If it were that easy…. Dry rock geothermal requires amongst other things > large amounts of fresh water for hydraulic fracturing of the reservoir. > This process needs to be repeated periodically as the reservoirs reseal up > over a period of years (as is being experienced by the shale oil fracked > wells) and in the case of dry rock geothermal when the heat reservoir > becomes drawn down. The hot steam that comes out of the wells is too laden > with minerals and salts to be used directly and it thus requires a duel > loop system in which the primary loop boils water in a boiler to produce > clean steam that is passed through the generators. > > Then there is the matter of earthquakes – including the I believe it was a > 5.3 on the Richter scale tremors linked to it in Basel. > > Dry rock geothermal certainly does have a big upside potential – there is > a whole lot of heat just a few miles below the ground, but it is not as > easy or simple as you seem to think it is. For example in a lot of dry > areas water supply becomes a gating factor that puts a limit on scalability > – this also applies to Canadian tar sands and shale gas plays – water > requirements will place a limit on how much it can scale; on the maximum > annual rates of extraction that can be achieved. > > Chris > > > > > > On Thu, Nov 14, 2013 at 6:39 PM, LizR <lizj...@gmail.com> wrote: > > On 15 November 2013 11:39, John Mikes <jami...@gmail.com> wrote: > > Telmo and other 'experts': > > why does nobody even mention the geothermic energy app - available in huge > Q-s and so far tapped only in (literalily) 'superficial' usage. The high > pressure ultra-clean steam from a deepened modification of the exhausted > oil wells may provide much much more energy than today's needs, so it could > serve as driving force for more than we think by ongoing technology. (E.g. > potable water, agri-irrigation, when fresh-water becomes scarce - like now > - pollution-free transportation, keeping politicians in asylum, etc.) . > > > > I assume you mean geothermal energy. It is used in New Zealand but doesn't > provide as much energy as wind and hydro as far as I know. > > > > It's an option in some parts of the world, certainly, but I would say > solar is more readily available overall. > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. 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