Dear Bruno,

On Sat, Dec 28, 2013 at 6:53 AM, Bruno Marchal <marc...@ulb.ac.be> wrote:

>
> On 28 Dec 2013, at 04:39, Stephen Paul King wrote:
>
> Dear Jason,
>
>   ISTM that the line " For each program we have generated that has not
> halted, execute one instruction of it for each (Program p in
> listOfPrograms)" is buggy.
>
> It assumes that the space of "programs that do not halt" is accessible.
> How?
>
>
> The space of all programs that do not halt is not Turing accessible.
> The space of all programs that do halt is not Turing accessible.
>
> The space of all programs (that do halt of do not halt) *is* accessible.
>

Could you elaborate on this claim. I wish to be sure that I understand
it. Is it really a "space"? Would it have metrics and topological
properties?



>
> All what happen is that we have no general systematic, computational,
> means to distinguish the programs that halt from the programs that does not
> halt (on their inputs), and that is why the universal dovetailer must
> *dovetail* on the executions of all programs.
>

Not having a "general systematic, computational, means to distinguish.."
has not stopped Nature. She solves the problem by the evolution of physical
worlds. I propose that physical worlds ARE a form of non-universal
computation.

I still think that the UD lives only in Platonia and is timeless and
static. Only its "projections" (to use Plato's cave metaphor) are run as
physical worlds if they can survive the challenge of mutual consistency.



>
> Bruno
>
>
>
>
>
> On Fri, Dec 27, 2013 at 10:09 PM, Jason Resch <jasonre...@gmail.com>wrote:
>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Dec 27, 2013 at 9:31 PM, Stephen Paul King <
>> stephe...@provensecure.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Jason,
>>>
>>>   Could you discuss the "trace of the UD" that LizR mentioned? How is it
>>> computed? Could you write an explicit example? I have never been able to
>>> grok it.
>>>
>>>
>> Bruno has written an actual UD in the LISP programming language.  I will
>> write a simple one in pseudo-code below:
>>
>> List listOfPrograms = new List[]; # Empty list
>> int i = 0;
>> while (true)
>> {
>>    # Create a program corresponding to the binary expansion of the
>> integer i
>>    Program P = createProgramFromInteger(i);
>>
>>    # Add the program to a list of programs we have generated so far
>>    listOfPrograms.add(P);
>>
>>    # For each program we have generated that has not halted, execute one
>> instruction of it
>>    for each (Program p in listOfPrograms)
>>    {
>>      if (p.hasHalted() == false)
>>      {
>>         executeOneInstruction(p);
>>      }
>>    }
>>
>>    # Finally, increment i so a new program is generated the next time
>> through
>>    i = i + 1;
>> }
>>
>>
>> Any program, and whether or not it ever terminates can be translated to a
>> statement concerning numbers in arithmetic. Thus mathematical truth
>> captures the facts concerning whether or not any program executes forever,
>> and what all of its intermediate states are. If these statements are true
>> independently of you and me, then the executions of these programs are
>> embedded in arithmetical truth and have a platonic existence.  The first,
>> second, 10th, 1,000,000th, and 10^100th, and 10^100^100th state of the UD's
>> execution are mathematical facts which have definite values, and all the
>> conscious beings that are instantiated and evolve and write books on
>> consciousness, and talk about the UD on their Internet, etc. as part of the
>> execution of the UD are there, in the math.
>>
>> Jason
>>
>>
>>
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>
>
>
> --
>
> Kindest Regards,
>
> Stephen Paul King
>
> Senior Researcher
>
> Mobile: (864) 567-3099
>
> stephe...@provensecure.com
>
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>
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> http://iridia.ulb.ac.be/~marchal/
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-- 

Kindest Regards,

Stephen Paul King

Senior Researcher

Mobile: (864) 567-3099

stephe...@provensecure.com

 http://www.provensecure.us/


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