No bet I'm afraid. I'm happy to concede on this point. When I think about it further, it makes sense that space must not expand in zones where gravity keeps objects from separating due to cosmological expansion. As a very well educated non-physicist/cosmologist, I've had occasion to be wrong several times on this list and I'm always prepared to revise my views. However, I'd still make the following points with regard to your dark matter theory. The observed optical warping of distant galaxies, in my understanding, was used to determine the location of dark matter; it was not the primary argument for the existence of it. That came from numerous observations of matter being more gravitationally bound than the observable matter could explain. Much more so. Crinkles around the edges of galaxies clearly do nothing to explain why galaxies seem hold together as if they had five times as much mass in them as we can see. Secondly, any such warping would be very easy to see in computer modelling. So why don't you use one of these tools: http://arxiv.org/abs/1212.4661 to check if your theory holds water? Funny that nobody has noticed it though.
With regards to the remark: "You're wrong on this. Remember that the next time you accuse me of being wrong about something." it's another example of your dismal grasp of logic and debate. Rightness or wrongness is a property of statements, not of people. I have no self-satisfied conviction of my intrinsic rightness and, contrary to remarks you've made before, I *love* to come across ideas that force me to revise my fundamental understandings. It's exciting and challenging. It's why I'm on this list. When I first read your universal present moment argument I did so with genuine open-mindedness. I'd have really enjoyed it if you'd succeeded in rocking my world. Unfortunately however you utterly failed to address the arguments put to you and you consistently exhibited a patronising, paternalistic attitude that merely ended up convincing me that you're an arrogant crackpot. But thanks for raising that $100. Because it's the first time you've acknowledged the fact that I challenged you to provide even a theoretical means of falsifying your theory. It wasn't even a bet. It was a free offer. The fact that you didn't respond was clearly a tacit acknowledgement of your incapacity to do so. So I ask: why should anyone be interested in a theory of time that a) solves no known scientific problems, b) contradicts all established empirical science and c) cannot be falsified experimentally? No, don't bother to answer. I've totally lost interest in what you have to say. On Wednesday, January 22, 2014 8:02:12 AM UTC+11, Edgar L. Owen wrote: > > Spud, > > We could always ask Kip Thorne who is a of course a leading authority on > gravitation to judge. I'm just repeating what his book says. > > If anyone has the book Gravitation, Misner, Thorne and Wheeler explain > this on page 718. > > I also ran this dark matter theory by Leonard Susskind a couple years back > and he said it was certainly a possibility.. > > Edgar > > > > > On Tuesday, January 21, 2014 3:53:07 PM UTC-5, spudb...@aol.com wrote: >> >> How would you guys collect on this friendly bet? What evidence would >> definitively prove who is right? >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Edgar L. Owen <edga...@att.net> >> To: everything-list <everyth...@googlegroups.com> >> Sent: Tue, Jan 21, 2014 1:47 pm >> Subject: Re: A humble suggestion to the group >> >> Pierz, >> >> How about a $100 bet on who's right about spacetime expansion? You or >> Misner, Thorne, Wheeler and me? >> :-) >> >> Edgar >> >> >> >> On Monday, January 20, 2014 6:42:59 PM UTC-5, Pierz wrote: >>> >>> Haha. >>> >>> Edgar, I have also modified my views through participation on this >>> list. As it has for Liz, Bruno's "comp" has become borderline credible to >>> me, though I am far from a "true believer". I've also been educated in a >>> lot of philosophy of mind and had my grasp of key concepts in physics >>> refined and sharpened. My fundamental position on AI has been altered >>> significantly. The process of changing one's core beliefs is a slow, >>> iterative one. Everyone's world view is a work in progress, or should be. >>> But necessarily and rightly, we change by doing our best to defend our >>> ideas against attack and critique. There's a certain irony to your remarks, >>> because I have certainly seen not an iota of willingness on your part to >>> change *your* views. It seems rather that you think it your business to >>> bring enlightenment to everyone else here without truly opening your eyes >>> and ears to competing or contradictory ideas. And it's rather disingenuous >>> of you to talk about subjecting our ideas to a regime of tests when you >>> completely ignored my $100 challenge to define any way to experimentally >>> falsify your Universal Present Moment. That whole thread was the most >>> exhausting, prolonged piece of head-against-the-wall-bashing I've >>> encountered on this list, and believe me I've seen a few! >>> >>> On Tuesday, January 21, 2014 9:25:58 AM UTC+11, Brent wrote: >>>> >>>> On 1/20/2014 11:18 AM, Edgar L. Owen wrote: >>>> >>>> There are obviously a lot of very intelligent members here who are well >>>> read in modern science. I think everyone would agree with this. >>>> >>>> >>>> Except for a few that are unfamiliar with relativity theory. >>>> >>>> Brent >>>> >>> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Everything List" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to everything-li...@googlegroups.com. >> To post to this group, send email to everyth...@googlegroups.com. >> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. >> > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. 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