On 15 Apr 2014, at 00:30, Alberto G. Corona wrote:
2014-04-14 17:59 GMT+02:00 Bruno Marchal <marc...@ulb.ac.be>:
On 14 Apr 2014, at 09:40, Alberto G. Corona wrote:
2014-04-12 19:42 GMT+02:00 Bruno Marchal <marc...@ulb.ac.be>:
No doubt on this for me. Affordable, and with good user's manuals.
Most pregnant kids get pregnant before having has the sexual
education school classes according to a recent statistics.
For people like most of you, most of you also childless, that are
disconnected from your human inner sense, it is necessary to talk
about very basic chains of causations. People that believe that men
are machines, behave like machines. I ´m very sorry for you.
You silence the inner sense, your nous that tell you: No. that is
not right. This inner sense is the legacy of knowledge from
millions of previous generations. It is so important that it is
immediate. It is necessary a lot of indoctrination to silence it.
What is most urgent today is to remove all this indoctrination to
recover this inner sense, the common sense, the Nous of the Greek
Philosophers.
On the contrary, for abortion, both studies + listening to women
makes me feel according to women an inner sense on that matter.
Same for machine, I show that self-relatively correct machine can't
avoid the presence of a fist person point of view, with qualitative
properties, and this when using only the most classical definition
of knowledge.
It is your prejudice on the machines which makes you feel that such
an hypothesis would be a reductionism.
But how to talk about this with men that want other people to be
machines at the image and likeness of themselves?
On the contrary, I challenge the comp hypothesis. At first sight I
refute it, but then I shows that the math illustrates it is too
premature to say that it is refuted.
How to talk with machines that hate what makes humans above
anything else? how to talk with people that despises its own
humanity?. the only way is to talk in its own language.
Contraception reproduce most of the problems that I mentioned and
produce other new. You, machines, contemplate the blind process of
natural selection: machines have other machines, and these machines
have been selected to maximize fitness, In a firt approximation
fitness can be assimilated to the number and strength of the child
machines produced.
There are two kind of machines 1 and 2. both produce third copies
of themselves.
Think a little bit: machine 1 and 2 programs main purpose, by the
very nature of natural selection, to produce copies. If machine 1
and machine 2 get crazy by a virus program that impede the creation
of copies. When the main program find that there is no copies
produced for whatever reason, it is logical that natural selection
have produced the following automatic strategies:
1) try to intensify the frequency f transfer of information in
order to try to make the reproduction mechanism to work.
2) if this does not work, machine 1 and 2 will transfer
information with other machines 2 and 1 respectively. infidelity
3) finally the pair will break. the process will repeat
indefinitely. 1 2 3 again and again.
Because the phase 1 of the life program of machine 1 and 2 is not
sucessfully executed, both stay in this phase of the program, that
I may call "adolescence" , characterized by a look for couples,
trying to be attractive and try to monopolize as much machines of
the other type as possible by means of pacific or violen means or
whatever in the middle. and for living in the urgence of the
present. This is realized in the form of ridculous display of
power, false intelligence, egotism, violence, money and beauty,
even at advanced age. But also by excessive exhibitions of
sentimentalsm hate and whatever that permits the creation of gangs.
Phases 2 and 3 never get executed: let´s call it "adult
responsiblity" and "devotion to past and future generations" since
natural selected algoritms of the machines must cover second and
third level of fitness parameters by making sure that the society
of machines work well and will work well for the future
generations. If this is not covered with proper machine activities
then no matter the number of machines produced in the next
generation, if the society dies a few generations later, the
machine fitness will be zero.
The net effect is uncertainty, violence, hypersexualization and
unhappiness. And the destruction of the society, by the way. but
because you are machines uncapable to acknowledge that, since you
hate and repress what is human, yo can not agree. is your
reputation as machines what is at stake
I think you confuse me with someone else. I am a logician. All what
I say is that IF we are machine, then Plato's theology and the
mystic is more rational than Aristotle and the materialists/
naturalist.
So you not only are machines, but a degraded form of machines if
you disobey your inner program. But I do not expect that machines
like you, victims of a indoctrination virus realize that simple
reasoning.
I am open to non computationalist theory, but when should we say no
to the doctor? When he proposes glasses?, an artificial kidney?, an
artificial hippocampus? ... tell me.
What I said is not related with you neither with COMP neither with
yes doctor or not doctor. I talk at the level of an architect. You
talk as a brick-ologists.
Read what I wrote. Machine intelligence is not a question of
brickology. Intelligence is not something which can be engineered.
It is a question of exploration of some reality, and it is a question
of us being sufficiently inetlligent to recognize intelligence here
and there along that exploration.
I don´t care about your substitution level. I tell you that if you
don't get smart and leave your obsessions,, sooner or later a gang
of islamist will enter your laboratory, will burn your computer and
will force you to worship Allah.
On the contrary. when people will understand that machines have
already a very rich theology, and that theology can be done in the
usual occam-based semi-axiomatic way (like in science "well done"),
the fundamentalism will be naked and people will understand why they
are only cast by people who lost faith. A "scientific" faith makes you
understand that in all domain, but doubly so in theology, violence and
authoritative argument have zero value.
By the way, Plato and Plotino talked about Justice, Love, Politics.
Where are these subjecs is your binary sequences?
In the hope and work of the honest persons and may be with the help of
some unknown.
It is obviously a quite interesting subject, but also it leads to
quite complex problems, but if you grasp that comp implies platonism
(to be short), you can expect that maybe Plato and Plotinus might not
be completely wrong on Justice, love, and many things, and probably
Indians, Chinese, (in the antic), etc. This does not follow logically
today.
Bruno
I told here about what is different in contraception from abortion.
The rest of the effects are the same. Among them, and relevant for
machines like you is the knowledge and information that will be
undoubtedly lost and the knowledge that we will simple not gain in
the future due to the population limitation and reduction and thus
the loss of collective intelligence, also due to the inherent
limitations of the adolescent phase.
I guess you misunderstood me. I want abortion legal to be able to
limit it and reduce the harm. Contraception limits also abortion and
is something even less avoidable, ... then people do as their inner
sense told them, and nobody can think for the other. I am not
convinced by your argument above.
Darwin has also been criticized as someone diminishing the human
(becoming a cousin of the chimpanzee) and I understand it is not
easy to embrace the idea that the universal numbers constitutes a
new infinity of cousins. You might have missed the discovery of
Turing, Post, Church, Kleene, and ... Gödel, Löb, etc. This really
has demolished the (common) reductionist conception of the machines
and the numbers.
Bruno
http://iridia.ulb.ac.be/~marchal/
--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
"Everything List" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email
to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
