Thank you for that lucid summary. I knew we weren't in a Tipler universe due to dark energy, and I remember he made some testable predictions including the Higgs mass, but I hadn't checked the figures. I have a feeling gravitational shear (or something similar) also came into it - I suppose the whole concept begs the question of whether one could perform an infinite number of calculations during the collapse of a star to form a black hole (perhaps a suitably prepared star...)
If one *can* perform an infinite number of calculations inside a collapsing star (this would I imagine involve space-time being continuous all the way down?) then perhaps one can also make a time machine from a finite, very heavy rotating cylinder as in the Larry Niven story... :-) On 11 November 2014 06:02, John Clark <[email protected]> wrote: > On Fri, Nov 7, 2014 at 10:56 PM, LizR <[email protected]> wrote: > > On 8 November 2014 12:55, spudboy100 via Everything List < >>> [email protected]> wrote: >>> >> >> Just to throw my own opinion in, according to Moravec, QI isn't the >>> primary method of immortality (or post mortality) it is the reconstruction >>> of dead people via ultra-massive, computer re-simulation. Moravec's >>> description in Mind Children, it was computers built out of neutron star >>> material (degenerate matter) used to produce 10^60 operations per second. >>> >> >> > Also according to Frank Tipler, although he appears to require a >> recollapsing universe to do it (I'm not sure why). >> > > It's because that's how Tipler wanted to get the infinite energy needed to > perform a infinite number of calculations needed for infinite subjective > time, he said so back in 1993 when he wrote an interesting book called "The > Physics of Immortality". In 2007 the poor man went a little funny in the > head, you know, just a little funny, and he went and did a silly thing; he > wrote another book saying we should look for divine DNA on the Shroud of > Turin and check for radiation around the tomb of the Blessed Virgin Marry > that was caused by an intense beam of neutrinos that must have shot out of > the bottom of her feet as she ascended into heaven. > > Anyway, in 1993 he still had all his marbles and he gave a fairly > plausible rough outline of how the universe might be able to perform an > infinite (not just very large) number of calculations; to do that you'd > need an infinite (not just very large) amount of energy but he thought the > laws of physics and of cosmology were so constituted as to allow for that. > If you could perform an infinite number of calculations then infinite > subjective time is possible even if objectively time comes to an end. > > From the assumption that immortality was physically possible Tipler worked > backward and made a number of predictions about what he thought the laws of > the universe must be for immortality to happen. Tipler's predictions turned > out to be wrong, some spectacularly wrong; he predicted the expansion of > the universe would slow down, then it would stop, then it would change > direction and collapse in on itself; from the heat of that imploding > fireball he thought a hyper-advanced civilization could theoretically > extract an infinite amount of energy. But we now know that due to Dark > Energy the expansion of the cosmos is accelerating not decelerating so that > fireball will never happen. Tipler also predicted that the Higgs boson must > be at 220GEV +- 20 but we now know its 125.3GEV +- .5 and he predicted > that the Hubble constant must be less than or equal to 45 but we now know > its 67.8 +- .77 . It's clear we don't live in the sort of universe that > Tipler thought we did. > > John K Clark > > > > > > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
