Thank you for that lucid summary. I knew we weren't in a Tipler universe due to dark energy, and I remember he made some testable predictions including the Higgs mass, but I hadn't checked the figures. I have a feeling gravitational shear (or something similar) also came into it - I suppose the whole concept begs the question of whether one could perform an infinite number of calculations during the collapse of a star to form a black hole (perhaps a suitably prepared star...)
If one *can* perform an infinite number of calculations inside a collapsing star (this would I imagine involve space-time being continuous all the way down?) then perhaps one can also make a time machine from a finite, very heavy rotating cylinder as in the Larry Niven story... :-) On 11 November 2014 06:02, John Clark <johnkcl...@gmail.com> wrote: > On Fri, Nov 7, 2014 at 10:56 PM, LizR <lizj...@gmail.com> wrote: > > On 8 November 2014 12:55, spudboy100 via Everything List < >>> everything-list@googlegroups.com> wrote: >>> >> >> Just to throw my own opinion in, according to Moravec, QI isn't the >>> primary method of immortality (or post mortality) it is the reconstruction >>> of dead people via ultra-massive, computer re-simulation. Moravec's >>> description in Mind Children, it was computers built out of neutron star >>> material (degenerate matter) used to produce 10^60 operations per second. >>> >> >> > Also according to Frank Tipler, although he appears to require a >> recollapsing universe to do it (I'm not sure why). >> > > It's because that's how Tipler wanted to get the infinite energy needed to > perform a infinite number of calculations needed for infinite subjective > time, he said so back in 1993 when he wrote an interesting book called "The > Physics of Immortality". In 2007 the poor man went a little funny in the > head, you know, just a little funny, and he went and did a silly thing; he > wrote another book saying we should look for divine DNA on the Shroud of > Turin and check for radiation around the tomb of the Blessed Virgin Marry > that was caused by an intense beam of neutrinos that must have shot out of > the bottom of her feet as she ascended into heaven. > > Anyway, in 1993 he still had all his marbles and he gave a fairly > plausible rough outline of how the universe might be able to perform an > infinite (not just very large) number of calculations; to do that you'd > need an infinite (not just very large) amount of energy but he thought the > laws of physics and of cosmology were so constituted as to allow for that. > If you could perform an infinite number of calculations then infinite > subjective time is possible even if objectively time comes to an end. > > From the assumption that immortality was physically possible Tipler worked > backward and made a number of predictions about what he thought the laws of > the universe must be for immortality to happen. Tipler's predictions turned > out to be wrong, some spectacularly wrong; he predicted the expansion of > the universe would slow down, then it would stop, then it would change > direction and collapse in on itself; from the heat of that imploding > fireball he thought a hyper-advanced civilization could theoretically > extract an infinite amount of energy. But we now know that due to Dark > Energy the expansion of the cosmos is accelerating not decelerating so that > fireball will never happen. Tipler also predicted that the Higgs boson must > be at 220GEV +- 20 but we now know its 125.3GEV +- .5 and he predicted > that the Hubble constant must be less than or equal to 45 but we now know > its 67.8 +- .77 . It's clear we don't live in the sort of universe that > Tipler thought we did. > > John K Clark > > > > > > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
