Kim, you wrote a lot of reasonable things except one: agreeable meanings of terms like 'democracy', anarchy, government, tribal- and "set" etc. I denied the habitual application of the 1st one, especially in Buno's term you mentioned: "1 head, 1 vote", since - as you pointed out - heads are very different. I mentioned the wishful solution Lenin outlined: development of a NEW humanity, diligent according to everyone's talents per se, unselfish and helpful to all. No "owners" mentioned, especially not for products Nature provides. No employers/emplyees mentioned. NO "GROWTH"!
Let us avert our thinking from the ongoing mess - economical, political, national, governmental whatever - try not to mix-and-match reasonable for the future with the unbearable for the present/past. I confess: I have no such (practical?) solution in mind, but it looks like one way humanity CAN survive. Am I pessimistic? you bet. JohnMikes On Sat, Jan 10, 2015 at 1:25 AM, Kim Jones <[email protected]> wrote: > > On 10 Jan 2015, at 10:20 am, meekerdb <[email protected]> wrote: > > On 1/9/2015 2:56 PM, Kim Jones wrote: > > > > Democracy is great but is not robust enough to withstand the urge to > tribalism. Despite all systems of government and theories of statism and > collectivism - the fact remains that homo sapiens are divided into tribes. > This is so because it was the original disposition or orientation of > individuals toward each other in a "society". Geographical place of origin > has always and will always determine your "home" and there is quite simply > nothing more to it than that. Humans always see the devil in the people on > the other side of the river. > > In "parliamentary democracy" it is the function of the opposition to > oppose everything the government proposes. These people do their job well, > so it isn't surprising that governments are continually trying to dance in > treacle in parliamentary democracies. Thus, fight, battle, competition, > warring interests always determine the outcome as the barely-concealed > tribal affiliations take over. Madame Thatcher was right "There are only > families. Nothing else matters." > > Trouble is, no one ever wants to look at it from this apparently > simplistic tribal perspective because it necessarily implies the shitfight > of racism but maybe just take a look at the world already... > > > It's just the way Madison, Jefferson, and Franklin looked at it. They > tried to create a government in which contending "tribes" would prevent any > one "tribe" from gaining tyrannical power. > > Brent > > > So, if there are no friends (in love and war) but only clans with > territory and assets, we should perhaps look at the whole thing more > fruitfully from a game theory perspective. Democracy - if it means anything > other than Bruno's one man, one vote - means a kind of almost magical > momentary plateau of cooperation between hominids; entirely artificial and > unnatural. Cooperation amongst humans has nevertheless always happened > wherever humans have arisen, which is where the persistent clanlike or > tribal structure of human society comes from. It is always geographically > delimited somewhere in the past. Even the public religions are clans - in > fact the biggest clans of all because their members can live just about > anywhere on the globe and still call somewhere else special (Mecca, > Jerusalem etc) their "home" (read "tribal grounds"). I would say the true > ethology of human nature has yet to be fully grokked because it probably > involves something like Bruno's comp which predicts the plurality of > conscious perspectives and places an emphasis on the importance of all the > different (1p) perspectives. > > You cannot write the true and correct explanation of Human Nature if you > happen to be a human. > > The third person perspective only leads to clash and struggle as humans > revert to their natural deep mistrust of one another whenever they hear of > each other's existence and each others' competing needs. > > Also, group psychology is a little-understood aspect of human tribalism. > Groups are fascinating things. Colonies of minds. > > A few of the innumerable but presumably finite human sets: > > The Catholic set > > The Jewish set > > The Muslim set > > The Jihadist set > > The Neo-con set > > The El-pinko commie set > > The Hillbilly set > > The Tory set > > The Morris Dancers set > > The Private School set > > The Freemason set > > The Hollywood set > > The Upper North Shore set > > The Rich set > > The Poor set > > The Creative set > > The Anally-Retentive set > > The New Zealand set > > The Gay set > > The National Front set > > > > Etc. ad infinitum > > Some of these hominid clans are quite subtle. They all represent a > perspective but are all based on needs-satisfaction of one sort or > another. Personally, I try not to belong to any clans, but of course > cannot escape belonging to some of them simply by dint of being a human and > existing. It's a problem no one is really looking at. > > We are classified and known throughout life by our tribal origins in so > many ways (race, ethnicity, language, education, religion, political > affiliation etc.) > > It could be that in a way, clans form as a kind of suspension of the > natural hostility of individuals toward each other for the purpose of > better survival chances. Marriage and lineage cement things further. > Property and other assets are thrown in. The stakes are now quite high. > Secrecy now becomes an important part of the game. The need to know each > others' secrets is now what drives society. Arms races, that sort of thing. > > It doesn't matter what the official political narrative is of the day, it > will all be decided by the shaman when the moon reaches the third quarter, > the rains come and a young albino lamb is slaughtered as an offering. > > Kim Jones B. Mus. GDTL > > Email: [email protected] > [email protected] > Mobile: 0450 963 719 > Phone: 02 93894239 > Web: http://www.eportfolio.kmjcommp.com > > > *"I'm not saying there aren't a lot of dangerous people out there. I am > saying a lot of them are in government" - Russell Brand* > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. 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