On 4 February 2015 at 10:13, Jason Resch <[email protected]> wrote: > > > On Tue, Feb 3, 2015 at 4:55 PM, Stathis Papaioannou <[email protected]> > wrote: >> >> On 4 February 2015 at 09:26, Jason Resch <[email protected]> wrote: >> > >> > >> > On Tue, Feb 3, 2015 at 2:36 PM, Stathis Papaioannou <[email protected]> >> > wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On Wednesday, February 4, 2015, Jason Resch <[email protected]> >> >> wrote: >> >>> >> >>> I agree with John. If consciousness had no third-person observable >> >>> effects, it would be an epiphenomenon. And then there is no way to >> >>> explain >> >>> why we're even having this discussion about consciousness. >> >> >> >> >> >> On the contrary, if consciousness were an epiphenomenon that would >> >> explain >> >> why it evolved: it is a necessary side effect of intelligent behaviour, >> >> and >> >> was not developed as a separate, useless add-on. >> >> >> > >> > >> > If consciousness is a side-effect that has no other effects, then where >> > is >> > the information coming from when a person articulates something about >> > their >> > conscious experience? If consciousness itself has no effects at all, >> > then >> > how did the theory of epiphenomenalism come to be shared beyond the >> > conscious mind that first conceived of it? Wouldn't such a theory >> > necessarily be private and unsharable if consciousness has no effects? >> >> My position is that if physics is causally closed, then ipso facto >> consciousness is epiphenomenal. Otherwise, you would be able to devise >> a test to determine if a given system is conscious. > > > Why do you presume such a test is not possible? > > Jason
Could you suggest one? We could test other people, animals, computers, thermostats... -- Stathis Papaioannou -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
