On 03 Dec 2017, at 03:20, John Clark wrote:
On Thu, Nov 30, 2017 at 12:21 AM, <[email protected]> wrote:
JC> No, MMI alleges that everything that can happen does happen,
in a universe with 4 spacial dimension Coulombs law would have a
function of 1/ r^3, If string theory is right about such a
universe not violating the laws of logic then that universe can
happen. and if that universe can happen then MWI says it does
happen. And such a universe would exist in the Eternal Inflation
multiverse too.>
> But that's NOT what MMI alleges.
Bullshit.
> That's essentially what Tegmark claims,
I've read every one of Max Tegmark's books. Have you?
Tegmark is a well known many worlds advocate and thinks it is
true; he thinks that everything that does not violate the laws of
physics actually happens and I think he's probably right about
that. But Tegmark goes further than that, he thinks everything that
does not violate the laws of logic or mathematics does happen, and
I'm much more skeptical about that.
Well, we all know why. It is because you introduce some magical thing
to stop at the step 3 of the universal dovetailer argument. Assuming
Mechanism, like Everett did, and perhaps Tegmark too eventually, it is
not a matter of choice, or you have to explain what in the universal
wave is not computable, and how it plays a role in making
consciousness selecting the computations in the wave and avoiding
those in arithmetic. That will be difficult, as the universal wave
itself *is* semi-computable. I don't see how that is possible, without
abandoning the Church-Turing's principle, or computationalism.
Bruno
FOR Coulombs law to have a function of 1/ r^3 all you'd need is a
universe with 4 spacial dimensions, and If the string theorists are
right (a big if) then a universe with 4 spacial dimensions is
physically possible, in fact acording to them 10 physical
spacial dimension is logically NECESSARY.
String theory multiverse and many world multiverse having
nothing to do with each other my ass! Is it really your contention
that string theory is OK with a universe with 10 spacial dimensions
and one time dimension but not OK with a universe like this one
except that my coin came out heads instead of tails??
> but the Many Worlds of MWI have the SAME defining parameters
as our universe
There must be some physical principles that are true in every
world in the Everett multiverse, but what are they? Does the
gravitational constant have to have the same value in every universe
that it has here, is the Fine Structure Constant a pure number very
close to 1/137 everywhere? I don't know. I'm very confident the
second law of thermodynamics is true everywhere, I'm reasonably
confident the conservation of electrical charge is true everywhere,
but I'm less sure of the conservation of mass energy or angular
momentum. From a multiverse point of view some of the things that
seem absolutely fundamental to us may be be more like the number
planets in our solar system and have nothing to do with anything
fundamental.
> since OUR universe is claimed to be reproduced EXACTLY,
If you put a gun to my head I couldn't say what you were trying
to say by that.
> except for the measurements realized in [...]
Forget measurement! Measurement has nothing to do with the MWI, in
fact that is the one and only reason I am a Many Worlds fan, unlike
the other quantum interpretations it doesn't have to explain what
a measurement is, or a observation, or get mired in pointless
consciousness debates.
> Of course, if you set up a situation in which a quantum event is
amplified to give a difference in macroscopic outcomes, such as in
Schrödinger's cat, then you can say that the macroscopic uncertainty
has a quantum origin. But the majority of quantum events are not
amplified in this way.
So you really do think reality can be neatly divided between
quantum and non-quantum events, I have no idea where you got that
idea, I think it is more likely that EVERY quantum event gets
amplified, although some faster than others. After all the movement
of the planets and the ability to make good predictions of where
they will be centuries in the future with just a few simple
equations are the oddballs, most things are not like that at all,
even the movement of comets is vastly more complicated.
> they simply occur randomly
So I guess you think the universe is not deterministic. Me
too.
>In fact, when you think about it, the possible universes
claimed by MWI is HUGELY GREATER than the number claimed by string
theory EVEN IF OUR UNIVERSE IS THE ONLY POSSIBLE UNIVERSE -- not a
mere 10^500 -- since there's no limit on how many universes
metastasize when Joe the Plumber enters a casino
I don't know who Joe is but whatever your occupation if you can't
make discrimination of one part in 10^500 (and remember there are
only 10^80 atoms in the observable universe) then 10^500 universes
would be indistinguishable from infinity. So, can you see changes of
one part in 10^500?
John K Clark
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