> On 17 Dec 2018, at 14:57, Jason Resch <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > On Monday, December 17, 2018, Bruce Kellett <[email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: > On Mon, Dec 17, 2018 at 7:06 PM Jason Resch <[email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: > On Mon, Dec 17, 2018 at 1:50 AM Bruce Kellett <[email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: > On Mon, Dec 17, 2018 at 5:59 PM Jason Resch <[email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: > > What I am curious to know is how how many of these statements you agree with: > > "2+2 = 4" was true: > 1. Before I was born > 2. Before humans formalized axioms and found a proof of it > 3. Before there were humans > 4. Before there was any conscious life in this universe > 5. As soon as there were 4 physical things to count > 6. Before the big bang / before there were 4 physical things > > "2+2=4" is a tautology, true because of the meanings of the terms involved. > So its truth is not independent of the formulation of the question and the > definition of the terms involved. > > So would you say it was false before it was asked and the terms defined? > > The true/false dichotomy is not applicable to undefined terms. As in QM, > "Unperformed experiments have no results!" > > Was the 10^100th bit of Pi set only at such time that Pi was defined, or did > it have a set value before humans defined Pi? > > Before pi was defined, the question had no meaning. > > > But was it not in a certain sense inevitable that we would get "3" as the > first digit?
Only after Pi is defined, of course. But (of course again) that is true for physical objects too. Before the moon is defined, the question “does the moon exist” had no meaning. That does not make the moon not existing when the man were not there, nor does the human definition of Pi makes Pi different from 3,141592… before the human discovered and defined it. The circumference of a circle divided by diameter is a transcendant number, independently of the fact that some mammals or some alien ever get the fact. Bruno > > Jason > > > Bruce > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>. > To post to this group, send email to [email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>. > Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/everything-list > <https://groups.google.com/group/everything-list>. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout > <https://groups.google.com/d/optout>. > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>. > To post to this group, send email to [email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>. > Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/everything-list > <https://groups.google.com/group/everything-list>. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout > <https://groups.google.com/d/optout>. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
