> On 23 Sep 2019, at 12:50, Alan Grayson <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > On Monday, September 23, 2019 at 4:14:43 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> On 23 Sep 2019, at 05:24, Alan Grayson <[email protected] <javascript:>> >> wrote: >> >> >> >> On Sunday, September 22, 2019 at 7:39:50 PM UTC-6, Jason wrote: >> >> >> On Sun, Sep 22, 2019 at 8:15 PM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List >> <[email protected] <>> wrote: >> >> >> On 9/22/2019 3:46 PM, Jason Resch wrote: >> > every conceivable pattern that is possible can happen and would happen >> >> No. That is NOT the theory. The theory is that everything >> nomologically consistent with the initial conditions may happen. >> "Conceviable" is having a flat Earth and flying pigs. >> >> >> I qualified it with "that is possible", I grant that "conceivable" becomes >> superfluous with the "possible" constraint. Anyway, here is what Guth >> writes: >> >> “This process will repeat itself literally forever, producing a kind of a >> fractal structure to the universe, resulting in an infinite number of the >> local universes […] Of course this fractal structure is entirely on distance >> scales much too large to be observed, so we cannot expect astronomers to see >> it. Nonetheless, one does have to think about the fractal structure if one >> wants to understand the very large scale structure of the spacetime produced >> by inflation. Most important of all is the simple statement that once >> inflation happens, it produces not just one universe, but an infinite number >> of universes.” He concludes, “In an eternally inflating universe, anything >> that can happen will happen; in fact, it will happen an infinite number of >> times.” >> >> -- Alan Gutth, "Eternal inflation and its implications" ( >> https://arxiv.org/pdf/hep-th/0702178.pdf >> <https://arxiv.org/pdf/hep-th/0702178.pdf> ) >> >> Jason >> >> Unless Guth can plausbily argue why eternal inflation must occur, the claim >> goes far behind mere speculation since it's already beyond our ability to >> observe. AG > > Whatever is observable is dream-able, and so “observation” is not a good > criterion for deciding the ontology. > > You can't prove that arithmetic has a Platonic reality
I need you only to agree with x + 0 = x, and you do agree with this, as anyone reading books in physics. The “platonic” part is proved at a letter stage. > and lies at the core of everything we perceive and call the external world. It does not. That is the whole point. We get physics. You take it as a lie, because you have adopted Aristotle”s lmetaphysics: what I see in real. Platonism is born from the doubt that what we see is real, and its basic motivation is the (antic) dream argument, which becomes a mathematical theorem once we accept the Church-Turing thesis. > OTOH, it's child's play > to show that arithmetic arises immediately from observations of the > externally appearing world. AG Yes. The number are cool, they don’t lie, and reappear all the times at every level. That confirms more what the mechanist say, where for a physicist it is not entirely obvious why there is a physical world and why it obeys to mathematical laws. We just don’t know the truth. My work shows only how to test between (weak) Mechanism and (weak) Materialism, and shows that up to now, nature confirms Mechanism, at a place where all people accepting the notion of consciousness are made dizzy by the physicalist position which makes the mind-body problem unsolvable. Let us just pursue the research, and make the experience. Bruno > > That is the older anti-physicalist argument, already in Plato, and well > before. > > Bruno > > > >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Everything List" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to [email protected] <javascript:>. >> To view this discussion on the web visit >> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/afd58cc9-717f-4696-8223-9979e4db7872%40googlegroups.com >> >> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/afd58cc9-717f-4696-8223-9979e4db7872%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>. > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/b1571699-a49e-48e0-b1ef-2f9c85259ee5%40googlegroups.com > > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/b1571699-a49e-48e0-b1ef-2f9c85259ee5%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/BDE27048-78B9-4697-AFA8-2F11A567FCBD%40ulb.ac.be.
