On 6/4/2021 3:15 AM, John Clark wrote:
On Thu, Jun 3, 2021 at 8:29 PM 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List
<[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
/> It's not nearly as thin as the air that says it's a musket.
It's the obvious functional interpretation. /
I interpret that to mean you don't believe in the "original intent"
interpretation.
I'm certainly not wedded to that, but my point is that "original intent"
could most reasonably interpret "arms" as whatever soldiers are issued
to be in a militia. It would have swords and shields in 1200ce and
assualt rifles in 2021. In other words interpret it in terms function
in the world, not in terms of hardware at the time.
> /The use of "arms" to mean any weapon is clearly a derivative
extension of what a combatant originally wielded with his arm.
/
Well, I admit a linguist would say the weapon meaning of the word
"arms" is derived from the word for the limbs human beings used to
manipulate things, and a linguist would also say the derivation of the
word "calculus" comes from the Greek word for small stone or pebble,
but I don't think having completed a study of pebbles will help you
much on a calculus exam.
>> In 1787 the people that made cannons andwarships were called
arms manufacturers and that hasn't changed.It may be absurd
but that's the world we live in because nuclear weapons are
called "arms'', remember the SALT talks from the 1970s, the
Strategic Arms Limitation Talks? They were about the reduction
in the number of nuclear weapons manufactured by the US and USSR.
/> But they certainly didn't mean that in order to have well
regulated militia people had the right to keep and bear frigates. /
True, it's impossible for one man to carry a frigate, but it's
certainly possible for one man to carry and activate a nuclear
warhead, so I don't see your point. I'm also surprised to hear you
bring up the "well regulated militia" bit because for years courts
have been pretending that line didn't exist in the Constitution. The
only well regulated militias are state national guard units, and only
a tiny percentage of the population are members of the national guard,
but there are more privately owned guns in the US than there are
people in the country. And even when national guard members are called
to duty they don't use their personal guns, they use weapons provided
by the state.
It's unclear in the text, but I think the founders were thinking of
individuals being called up to form a militia. That's what happened in
putting down the Whisky Rebellion and Shay's Rebellion. I've proposed
that one resolution of the gun control controversy would be for states
to charter private militias who would keep track of members guns (say
keep them in an armory at a shooting range the way Brits do) and have
liability insurance covering their usage. The state would require that
they maintain certain standards of membership. To make this more
attractive to gun nuts, they, thru the militia, could own full-auto and
other prohibited individual arms.
Brent
I think the second amendment is the most sloppily written part of the
constitution, and that's really saying something considering what a
very imperfect document it is. At least the parts about slavery are
clear, they're not stupid, they're just evil.
John K Clark See what's on my new list at Extropolis
<https://groups.google.com/g/extropolis>
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