Rob, took you a while??? Did the Husky's break down? The downside of the F500 class is the lack of a gearbox from a advertising point of view. The upside is the afordability. As I said earlier, if you're targeting the younger crowd, pre-shifter class, then the F500 class is a pretty easy sell. Again, as was said earlier the shifters are more than likely faster on most tracks than a F500, so the sell to a shifter kart wouldn't be an easy one. "If" there's a way to sway the SCCA org to allow karter's an easier way to get a license in a F500 car that any other class, then I think the rest of the kart community would be an easier sell. Chris R
Rob Howden <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Neale... Don't count out the karters...only a very small handful can afford FBMW, Zetec, Mazda, or even FC. There are a lot of career-minded karters on a budget, you just need to focus your marketing to them on this point. 'Formula Car Racing on your Karting Budget - Click here to find out how!' Take care, Rob Howden Publisher / Editor-in Chief - ekartingnews.com - Super Kart Illustrated - eformulacarnews.com - FormulaCar Magazine Ph: 519-624-2003 Fax: 519-624-0053 P.O. Box 580 Cambridge, Ontario Canada N1R 5W1 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Neale Osenburg" To: Sent: Wednesday, July 26, 2006 11:13 AM Subject: Re: [F500] racing car counts > Steve was stating his reasons for why young karters are not attracted to the > class. I tend to agree with most of what he says. Young karters that want to > "move up" are immediately attracted to FC, FM, FBMW, etc... > > I think F500 would be better served in marketing towards an older "car club" > crowd. Perhaps people that are in to drifting want to get into real racing > after catching the bug during drifting. The ads in other mags (Racer, > Autoweek maybe) may help expose the class to someone other that current > racers or karters. > > > On 7/26/06, Dave Pomfret wrote: > > > > Steve, > > > > I think you are "right on". > > > > All the reasons you listed for the F500 not being part of the latter are > > also the reasons most of all chose F500 in the first place and the allure > > of > > the class. > > > > F500 is a stand alone class, few move to other levels (a generalization) > > and > > is experiencing a bit of a down cycle in participation. I just hate to > > see > > another SCCA class (F1000) come along that would take potential drivers > > from > > our ranks. > > > > Again, the items you listed are all addressed by F1000 (unfortunately) > > > > Dave Pomfret > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Steve K. > > Thompson > > Sent: Wednesday, July 26, 2006 8:29 AM > > To: [email protected] > > Subject: RE: [F500] racing car counts > > > > I'm probably going to get flamed like there's no tomorrow for this but, > > FWIW, I think the karting magazines may not be the best place for the > > majority of the advertising effort, although any effort is better than > > none. I think most serious karters, especially those looking to make > > money in racing which is pretty much most of them, would view F500 as a > > sidestep at best. F500 really does not offer a lot of value on the > > racing ladder. Which is not to say it is not the best bang for the buck > > competition-wise (if the fields were anywhere near the size they should > > be). Reasons why F500 is not on the 'ladder'. > > > > 1. Suspension. Generally those looking to progress from karting into > > larger formulae are heavy on car control, racecraft and aggression and > > light on car setup knowledge. Rubber pucks and 4 link suspensions have > > very little application on the higher rungs on the racing ladder. And I > > think the old Minardi cars used pivot torque for damping but they were > > about the only ones. > > > > 2. Solid Axle. Not too much more to say about this one except for the > > fact that you don't see a whole lot of them in formula racing. > > > > 3. Transmission. Many 'serious' racers think shifting makes a car faster > > and is necessary to bond with the car. We know it's more of a barrier to > > going fast but that's not the general opinion. Either way it is an > > essential skill for racing in the higher formulas, if not at the highest > > levels. Gearing is a very important aspect of car setup that F500 also > > has little application to. Not too many other race cars on the planet > > worry about clutch weights or what helix is in the secondary. > > > > 4. Engine. 2 stroke. Not that that's bad or should be a downside but it > > doesn't have much application at other levels. > > > > It's for these reasons I don't think we should present ourselves as a > > ladder formula. There isn't much for a karter to learn that will apply > > later on. I do think we should present ourselves as what we are, the > > best mixture of speed, simplicity, reliability and cost. We'll get a lot > > more response from more recreation oriented magazines like Grass Roots > > motorsports. We can offer the purity of response of a formula car and > > the speed of a FF for the price of an IT car. A decent FF engine costs > > 6-10k and a decent FC engine is about 12-14k complete. We cost 2k. And a > > lot of the national FC crowd are sending their heads out between races > > to be freshened. These are the major advantages of F500 and the reason > > most of us are probably racing it. > > > > If we wanted to be part of the ladder we would probably need to address > > changing some of the major aspects of the formula. Springs, shocks and > > A/R bars would be a good start but that's probably another discussion. > > > > How about this for a slogan? "F500: A complete car that eats FFs for > > less than the price of their engines"? > > > > CarbonX on. > > > > Steve > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:f500- > > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Joe Palmer > > > Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2006 9:52 PM > > > To: [email protected] > > > Subject: Re: [F500] racing car counts > > > > > > > > > Marshall and list, > > > > > > I think the Karting rags idea is a very good one and agree that it > > might > > > be > > > the best audience, or at least one of the best, for us to reach out > > to. > > > I've added it to my "project list" for next steps once we've nailed > > down > > > our > > > "message", slogan, etc. . . . which is coming along slowly since I've > > only > > > received about three from the list. C'mon guys & gals, let's see your > > > creativity . . . send me some slogans. I'll have a list out in about > > a > > > week > > > for a vote. > > > > > > I also think Mr. Schultz's comments about "Not Waiting" for the F5 > > > community > > > on some of this stuff is spot-on! Kinda goes along with my "Just Do > > It" > > > motto . . . write some articles and send 'em out to ALL the rags we've > > > mentioned in this thread (I have, but no "takers" yet)! Reach out to > > the > > > Karters in your area, talk to the other SCCAers who are struggling > > with > > > budget, do whatever it takes to further your own cause and that of our > > > class! > > > > > > Obviously, we all don't have the experience, depth, contacts, > > know-how, > > > and > > > drive of Schultz Racing. But we all have more than the Karters or > > other > > > interested parties who know next to nothing about our cars/class. If > > > every > > > one of us made it a goal to promote our class in at least one way over > > the > > > next year, I think we'd easily solve our problem and jump way up > > Stan's > > > list. > > > > > > Shiny Side Up, > > > Joe Palmer > > > TX Novakar #56 > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: > > > To: > > > Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2006 7:49 AM > > > Subject: Re: [F500] racing car counts > > > > > > > > > > > > > > GRM might reach a lot of potential racers, but I'd bet that the vast > > > > majority of their readership is tin-top drivers who are doing Solo > > II. > > > They will > > > > NOT understand the difference between SM and F500 at a relatively > > > similar > > > > apparent cost. (Note that I said 'apparent' - this is about > > > perception, > > > not > > > > reality.) This might get a few guys to come out and kick tires, > > but I > > > wouldn't > > > > bet the future of F500 on the GRM readers who have been reading > > > articles > > > > focused on semi-race-prepped Miatas, spitfires, RX7s, and BMWs. > > > > > > > > What about the karting mags? If you're interested in reaching young > > > karters > > > > looking for their next step, then you need to advertise in the > > > publications > > > > that they read. These seem to be fairly accessible, as well. > > > > > > > > Also, what about 'Road & Track' or 'AutoWeek'? Their readership is > > > made > > > up > > > > of frustrated street car polishers and wannabes......seems like > > fertile > > > > ground to me. > > > > > > > > IMNSHO, growth of an entry-level class needs to come from people who > > are > > > > currently sitting on the couch or competing in 'lower formulae', > > i.e. > > > karts, not > > > > those who are already SCCA competitors doing something different. > > > > > > > > Thoughts? > > > > > > > > MM > > > > > > > > In a message dated 7/24/2006 5:24:06 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, > > > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > > > > > > > > <<> > too. > > > > There's > > > > a source of new blood! > > > > > > > > Gene near Seattle > > > > > > > > > > > > On 7/23/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Since our cars are snowmobiles on wheels, how about an ad with a > > > picture > > > > > of a guy fully suited on a snowmobile during the summer. Caption > > the > > > > > picture "What did you do this summer?". Below that, run a > > picture of > > > a > > > > > F500 on the track captioned F500.ORG. >>> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > F500 mailing list - [email protected] > > > > To unsubscribe or change options please visit: > > > > http://f500.org/mailman/listinfo/f500 > > > > *** Please, DO NOT send unsubscribe requests to the mailing list! > > *** > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > F500 mailing list - [email protected] > > > To unsubscribe or change options please visit: > > > http://f500.org/mailman/listinfo/f500 > > > *** Please, DO NOT send unsubscribe requests to the mailing list! *** > > > > _______________________________________________ > > F500 mailing list - [email protected] > > To unsubscribe or change options please visit: > > http://f500.org/mailman/listinfo/f500 > > *** Please, DO NOT send unsubscribe requests to the mailing list! *** > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > F500 mailing list - [email protected] > > To unsubscribe or change options please visit: > > http://f500.org/mailman/listinfo/f500 > > *** Please, DO NOT send unsubscribe requests to the mailing list! *** > > > > > > -- > Neale Osenburg > _______________________________________________ > F500 mailing list - [email protected] > To unsubscribe or change options please visit: > http://f500.org/mailman/listinfo/f500 > *** Please, DO NOT send unsubscribe requests to the mailing list! *** > _______________________________________________ F500 mailing list - [email protected] To unsubscribe or change options please visit: http://f500.org/mailman/listinfo/f500 *** Please, DO NOT send unsubscribe requests to the mailing list! *** --------------------------------- Yahoo! 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