I prefer eformula..... CR Chuck Voboril <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Chris, Just don't let your tone get away from you and you should be able to discuss things anywhere.
I know it is easy to let your passion take over- However, it is worth trying because a good discussion usually helps everyone learn. I'm currently considering ceasing participation on this list and NOT signing up on the eforumula site. I will probably continue low level particpation on Apexspeed and the DSR list. I can't take on one more list/site-especially since eformula apears to be redundant to the more mature Apexspeed site. Hopefully, I can then concentrate on finishing my new car before I am too old, fat, dumb, and blind to drive :-> Chuck >From: Chris Reinhardt >Reply-To: [email protected] >To: [email protected] >Subject: Re: [F500] RE: Fud for discussion >Date: Sun, 8 Apr 2007 04:17:49 -0700 (PDT) > > Chuck, lets take this discussion to the eformula site, I get yelled at >everytime we argue... > > > CR > >Chuck Voboril wrote: > Chris, > >Why wouldn't an experienced race car fabricator use a Accumsump if it would >help him save the motors? I've used then myself, and I know they have >limitations. > >Now, as to Microsprints: > >A circle track pan is easier to baffle for oil control because the corners >are all the same direction. The pickup can be off to one side with almost >twice as much oil available to it with a one way door. > > >Then, What makes you think that all the corners are all short enough in >road >racing and cornering g-force low enough to permit a accusump band-aid to >supply oil long enough in road racing when the pickup is uncovered? > >Some road race corners are as long as some entire circle tracks and the >occassional long straight at peak RPM can pump the pan down low before even >entering the long corner. > >Accusmped Honda motors have blown-up (seized bearings, then thrown rods) >even in short solo corners from oil starvation. (Tage Evanson, for example) >And that was with a well baffled and doored pan. Lotsa transient sloshing >with air in the oil. > >A large dry sump tank allows the air to be separated from the oil before it >goes into the pressure pump. > >I kindly suggest that you get your car finished instead of spending your >time here and run a bunch of road courses, show proof of competitive >G-forces and lap times then come back with a solution. > >I honestly hope you can help the F500 guys find a proper choice of 4-stroke >and help them understand how to make it live on all road courses so it all >works out. > > > > >Chuck > > > > > > >From: Chris Reinhardt > >Reply-To: [email protected] > >To: [email protected] > >Subject: Re: [F500] RE: Fud for discussion > >Date: Sat, 7 Apr 2007 20:31:52 -0700 (PDT) > > > >OK Chuck I'll bite.... Did you ask how many of those blown up wet sump > >motors had a $175 Accusump? How many of those motors were 600's? Did you > >ask around and see any 600 Micro's that had the same problem??? > > > > CR > > > >Chuck Voboril wrote: > > Dave, > > > >Here goes... roughly in your order :-> > > > >I would not say that 4 strokes suck, but they are nothing special either. > >I've gone and asked around to verify that I was correct in cautioning > >people > >on 4 strokes needing dry sumps. > > > >You can add that expense and the dry sump's extra weight to Jay's 50# > >estimated overall extra weight for a 4 stroke > > > >The Wests that CR mentioned still lose R1 motors. One lost 2 motors at >one > >event. > > > >In SCCA homologating a car only applies to the chassis. There is nothing >to > >keep one from using a dry sump if the drawings submitted showed a wet >sump > >motor. Not sure what the homologation routine is in IMSA. > > > >Phoenix Race cars designed their new F1000 chassis to accept a wet or dry > >sump motor, but they say one would have to be a slow driver or penny-wise > >and dollar-foolish to run a wet sump R1. > > > >Every race shop I have spoken with says any motor with oil that must be > >recycled from the crankcase instead of bring burned needs a dry sump if >the > >car makes much more than about 1.2 G. > >(FF1600 is at 1.6G). Not to say someone may get a really well designed > >baffled sump and accusumo to work-but I bet it won't work everywhere nor >on > >all motors. Gven a long enough corner, all accusmps run out of oil. > > > >Shifting is OK but nothing special either. > > > >If gear ratios are to be stock-then I can see people doing engine swaps > >between different brand 4 strokes depending upon the track. > >Probably should settle upon one brand and model 600cc motor. > > > >Shocks are good to have to improve safety, also good to learn on for >those > >with real pro class racing ambitions. Probably more important to >understand > >than moving a gearshift lever. > > > > > >IMHO below-not official view of MAC: > >120 HP should be the driveable target HP for Vees. > > > >There have to be some reminders on limitations on the 1600cc 10:1 setup > >with its non-stock valves and more carb choices so that it will not be > >clearly superior to the 1915cc 9:1 single carb, stock valve choice. > > > >The present SV rules plainly do not allow any chamber work and this >should > >not be changed IMHO. The larger 1915cc bore does not inherently unshrould > >the valves. The shrouding is from the deep chamber sides next to the > >valves, not the bore. > > > > > >Chuck > > > > > > > > > > > > >From: Dave Phaneuf > > >Reply-To: [email protected] > > >To: [email protected] > > >Subject: [F500] List still active? > > >Date: Sat, 07 Apr 2007 17:50:48 -0400 > > > > > >Chuck, > > >Still alive, just nothing to bitch about at the moment. I'm sure you > >could > > >start something, maybe like... 4 strokes suck, shifting sucks, shocks > > >are a waste of money, and the new solo vee's will make 155HP! > > >....... ducking till Monday. > > >Dave Phaneuf > > > > > > > >--------------------------------- > >TV dinner still cooling? > >Check out "Tonight's Picks" on Yahoo! TV. > > > >--------------------------------- >Bored stiff? Loosen up... >Download and play hundreds of games for free on Yahoo! Games. --------------------------------- Expecting? Get great news right away with email Auto-Check. 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