Comments in between --- In [email protected], "Marek" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Comment below: > *** > > --- In [email protected], "shempmcgurk" > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > Marek, > > > > That's all very nice as both an esoteric explanation and > > justification as to why MMY has done things. > > > > Regardless, I must observe and assess those things from my own, > > admittedly, limited western-based consciousness of values. And > > those values include science, rationality, and common sense. > > > > But guess what? I started TM -- and got involved in the TMO -- > > under the auspices of science, rationality, and common sense. > There > > was NO PLACE for gurus, blind devotion, and cults in either TM or > > the TMO when I joined up. > > > > So I very well may be thinking and operating from an inferior and > > limited state of consciousness and values but that is the level at > > which TM was supposed to work...so that is the level at which I > will > > assess MMY and his activities. > > **SNIP TO END** > > I can't (and don't) disagree with you, but if we refuse to evaluate > the merits of meditation on any other metric than the "western-based > consciousness of values" it's obvious that we're going to be > disappointed with the "ultimate" results. *** I too started TM -- and got involved in the TMO -- under the auspices of science, rationality, and common sense. And that is were I stand even now. I also feel that I have made a lot of progress in inner transformation. From my perspective it seems that those who lose touch with common sense have fallen in a pitfall. I never felt attracted to MMY's persona, and have not got too much emotionally involved in the success of the movement. So I have to disappoint you by having not become disappointed in the TMO. It has been very interesting and fascinating to follow its doings. I have learned a lot and am still learning thanks to the deluded behaviour of TMO and MMY. But I feel sorry for people, who have gullibly believed all the promises and been drawn to a swamp of ever deepening departure from reality to illusions and efforts to create a dream reality. > > We're all very much aware by this point that Maharishi was "selling" > TM to the West based on the "benefits" of meditation he perceived > westerners would value and were more or less likely to be enjoyed by > most people who meditated correctly. But, in my experience at > least, it didn't take much more than an advanced lecture or two to > realize that TM, in spite of the initial sales pitch, was part of an > esoteric Indian tradition and it was that underlying philosophical > structure that provided the real framework in which the significant > growth or progress of the meditator could be evaluated. > > Also, once you saw Maharishi and spent any time with him (or spoke > with anyone who had spent time with him) it was clear that what > Maharishi was actually promising was a level of happiness and life > satisfaction that was far beyond getting better grades, or a more > restful night's sleep, or less stress, etc. It was Bliss that he > was promising and furthermore, his person radiated that message with > tremendous wattage. *** To recognize this you don't need to give up honesty, critical self assessment and common sense. At least I haven't. > > That fundamental message or offer is the same that all the saints > have always proclaimed. For some reason, though, Maharishi just > always emphasized the relative values over the absolute even though > he always talked about the absolute. It's like he never trusted > that people would be drawn to the deeper spiritual values over the > relative ones. 200% of life, All Glories Worldly and Divine -- it > sounds fine and all -- it sounds great when all you want is more > money, more power, more sex, etc., but if you get 100% of the Divine > Glory (or even some real taste of it ) then the other 100% just > doesn't even exist, much less matter. *** According to this logic it seems that MMY has never got real taste of the Divine, because he has exhibited so much craving for money and power. MMY has never given up his manipulative thinking when it comes to collecting money and to securing his position. Manipulative thinking is rational, but in a limited way. It is very egoistic, while skillfully hiding those motives. > > At some point, based on your own experience, you've got to come to > the realization that there's nothing -- no thing -- that's ever > going to satisfy. Ever. And yet acquiring and amassing things is > core to the current cultural paradigm, maybe has always been core > and probably is just the nature of the mind itself. So, as far as I > can figure out, you've got to start re-evaluating what it is you > really want and what is the scale on which you measure its > achievement. Real and permanent achievement (fulfillment) can't be > on the level of the body or the mind or anything else in the world. > If you limit yourself to what you can get or are in the world as the > measure of how good or useful something is to you, then TM is going > to come up short regardless but its real value is in transcending. *** I agree with this. > > I think we've got to expand our models of evaluation. > > Marek To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
