--- In [email protected], "Yifu" <yifuxero@...> wrote: > > I disagree.
Then you disagree with Maharishi AND you presume that Satyanand imagined or fabricated his story. If, as Maharishi stated, reaching the status of Krishna requires another series of incarnations into bodies finer than the physical after having achieved Unity Consciousness, that clearly shows that there is an individuality who has achieved Unity Consciousness that does all that further incarnating. And, if indeed Guru Dev was enlightened, how could he speak to Satyanand after his death if he had gone out of existence? > Accounts of various people on this forum tend to outweigh the "subtle > existence" option as to the official TMO dogma. (the witnesses have heard the > statements directly from "the Man" himself and his mouthpieces.). The > official dogma appears to be complete nonexistence. > ... > We must remember that Sat. is a direct disciple of Guru Dev, true? > The religious orientation of the latter is geared toward devotion to the > "Gods"; especially various form of the Divine Mother. (thus, the name > "Saraswati". If M. had called himself Maharishe Mahesh Yogi Saraswati, then > I would inquire if he were a devotee of that or another Goddess. > ... > Devotion to the "Gods" appears to be anathema to the TMO; although we all > know about or have read MMY's account of his own devotion to "God", Brahman. > (a perfectly legitimate orientation shared by Ramana although the latter used > the word "Self"). Muktananda says "Love God as your own Self". > ... > But the Paul Mason quotes of Guru Dev clearly show a place for devotion to > the "Gods"...i.e. especially various Divine Mother forms along with the Sri > Yantra as mention in Swami Rama's book. > ... > Apart from being nondualists, I'd say that MMY and Guru Dev lived on > different planets. > > --- In [email protected], "do.rflex" <do.rflex@> wrote: > > > > > > > > --- In [email protected], "John" <jr_esq@> wrote: > > > > > > We are part and parcel of God, but can never be God, according to Srila > > > Prabhupada. I believe MMY wanted to say the same thing to you about this > > > subject. > > > > > > > > > No. The point being made here is that when one reaches Cosmic, God, or > > Unity Consciousness, and then dies, we DO NOT vanish into the void of the > > undifferentiated Absolute [as the commonly used phrase goes, "The drop > > becomes the ocean," suggesting that the soul vanishes as an individual > > soul]. > > > > In other words, the comments from both Maharishi and Satyanand clearly > > indicate that there is STILL an individuality after death when one is > > enlightened and drops the body. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In [email protected], "do.rflex" <do.rflex@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I asked Maharishi at TTC [Estes Park, CO] if when we reach UC are we > > > > then like Krishna. He answered very quickly saying, "No, that would > > > > require another series of incarnations into bodies finer than the gross > > > > physical." He then quickly changed the subject and said nothing further > > > > about it. > > > > > > > > > > > > To further make the point that dropping the body in 'enlightenment' > > > > doesn't mean that one completely dissolves, here's a story that > > > > Brahmachari Satyanand told of his experience after the death of Guru > > > > Dev: > > > > > > > > --Brahmachari 'Swami' Satyanand speaking c1967 about Guru Dev's > > > > 'nirvana'-- > > > > > > > > 'When in 1953 Guru Dev left this mortal frame and attained nirvana I > > > > was at Benares, another place of pilgrimage for Hindus, and at that > > > > moment I was staying in the ashram of Guru Dev. > > > > > > > > Everybody knew that I am very attached to Guru Dev and devoted to Guru > > > > Dev, and then news came to Benares that Guru Dev has attained nirvana. > > > > I was sitting somewhere with a group of my friends and the news was > > > > relayed there. > > > > > > > > When my friends heard that Guru Dev was no more they were very anxious > > > > about me and when they conveyed that news, they were rather alert to > > > > appraise whatever reaction is and what happened, I simply, when I heard > > > > that news I became very sad, very sorry and I just kept my head on the > > > > table before me. And all of them were very anxious what will become of > > > > me. > > > > > > > > But soon after, while I was very morose, sorrow, sad, entire world was > > > > empty for me and I did not understand what to do without Guru Dev, just > > > > a half a minute or two seconds after, a flash came and it appeared to > > > > me that Guru Dev was scolding me; > > > > > > > > "What a fool you are! You have been with me for all > > > > these many months and years, and you heard my discourses > > > > too. Is it a moment of feeling sorry? Why should you be > > > > sorry today? And you think that I am gone, where am I > > > > gone? > > > > > > > > "Till now whenever you wanted to meet me, you had, you > > > > had to come to the place where I was, and today when I > > > > have attained nirvana, I am everywhere, I am omnipresent. > > > > Where have I gone? > > > > > > > > "Very foolish for you to mourn on this occasion. > > > > I am with you, here, there, everywhere. Why should you > > > > be sorry?" > > > > > > > > And the moment this flash came, my face became very brilliant, I became > > > > very cheerful. And when I raised my head, my friends who were standing > > > > there, very anxious and held in suspense, they were upset to see my > > > > brilliant and cheerful face. And then they said, "What has happened to > > > > you?" I said, "No you can't understand, nothing has happened to me, I > > > > am alright, now let me go back to the ashram and make the necessary > > > > arrangements."' > > > > > > > > From: http://www.paulmason.info/gurudev/Satyanand.htm > > > > > > > > > >
