Carol - so awesome you could see that - however these Gurus, the very ones committing and teaching soul murders are the ones that are worshiped by the burdened liberals - eager to numb their pain, eager to abdicate responsibility to these Gurus- this 2000 year old childish fascination with a messiah suffering for our sins - these masochistic messiahs, adored for their masochistic, life-abnegating, life-numbing feats of physical endurance masqueraded as sacrifice and spirituality.
On Sun, Jan 27, 2013 at 4:56 PM, Carol <[email protected]> wrote: > ** > > > typo: I no longer knew me...not I know longer knew me. Ha. > > > --- In [email protected], "Carol" wrote: > > > > That makes sense to me...as far as turning the experience into a > philosophy that results in "repression,perversion and/or other life > abnegating practices." > > > > In my previous belief system which was Bible based, we referred to those > who are 'telios' being fully mature spiritually. We were the > initiated...the enlightened (but not necessarily the same enlightenment as > what others in Far East philosophies refer to). > > > > But, what I discovered in becoming teleioo is what I term 'soul murder' > or 'soul suicide.' I know longer knew me and ended up a shell of a person. > I hope to never go back to that state. (Not saying that is what the > Biblical word refers to, but rather it was distorted.) > > > > Something I had typed (and then deleted) in my previous comment was, "It > simply is." "It" referring to enlightenment..or whatever one wants to call > it. > > > > Kind of like breath...it is. Or life. Or even death. It is. > > > > ************** > > > > --- In [email protected], Ravi Chivukula wrote: > > > > > > This is well and good Carol. However most in spirituality make the end > - such as detachment, freedom as a way of living, as philosophy resulting > in repression, perversion and/or other life abnegating practices. Hence the > fascination for Gandhi, Teresa, Dalai Lama, Ammachi - these pseudo > spiritual life abnegating, poverty worshiping icons, messiahs. So this is > something to be remembered - that detachment, freedom, humility are the end > product and cannot be wrapped into a belief system or a style of living. > > > > > > > > > On Jan 27, 2013, at 2:44 PM, "Carol" wrote: > > > > > > > Thanks for the responses. > > > > > > > > In reading them one word comes to mind...freedom. > > > > > > > > And then I think...Freedom from attachment. > > > > > > > > But, then I think, of emotions and the feelings of attachment. > Attachment isn't a bad thing; it just depends on the timing and the type of > attachment. > > > > > > > > Such as children. I love my children and will always feel attached > with them. But, as they have grown into adults, I've had to let go of parts > of that attachment. > > > > > > > > Hmm....there is a new freedom in letting go of that attachment with > my children. It is a different kind of attachment now because they don't > need me like they did when they were infants and youngsters. > > > > > > > > In the past years I thought of 'enlightenment' kind of like someone > being on an ego trip. But, I never really asked about it or read up on it. > Apparently, I was assuming and/or reading into the term from my own past > experiences. > > > > > > > > From reading the responses here, the responses don't come across as > ego trips. > > > > > > > > ********* > > > > > > > > --- In [email protected], Ravi Chivukula wrote: > > > > > > > > > > On Sun, Jan 27, 2013 at 12:09 PM, Carol wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > ** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I find your response interesting. Ravi, I started another thread > regarding > > > > > > enlightenment here: > > > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/message/333764 > > > > > > > > > > > > Would you mind commenting on that thread? (Just to keep the > comments > > > > > > together. Hope that is an okay request here on FFL.) > > > > > > > > > > > > In your words, what is "enlightenment?" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thank you Carol. Here's what I came up for your question. > > > > > > > > > > Enlightenment creates a state of consciousness, a context of > self-freedom > > > > > in which one is not constrained by anything outside of oneself > even as one > > > > > performs normal actions and goes through normal moods as everyone > else. An > > > > > unperturbed inner state of mind untouched, untainted, > unconditioned by > > > > > anything. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thank you! > > > > > > ************* > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In [email protected], "Ravi Chivukula" wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "Meditation gets you there faster, no?" > > > > > > > No this is a wrong notion that I see being perpetuated by > everyone I > > > > > > > hear. Meditation lets you purify your body, mind and senses so > the > > > > > > > transition is smoother, easier when the mystical energy > descends. When > > > > > > > this happens and if it indeed happens is a big question mark > and has no > > > > > > > relation to a regular meditation practice such as in my case. > Two years > > > > > > > down the line I seem to agree with Vaj that TM is an unhealthy > > > > > > > meditation technique that can cause abnormal states of mind - > better to > > > > > > > stick with hatha yoga, pranaayama etc. So enlightenment is not > an > > > > > > > achievement. This is the problem I had with most on Batgap - > what most > > > > > > > are describing there are some altered states of consciousness > created by > > > > > > > their meditation techniques. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
