On 05/25/2014 12:54 AM, salyavin808 wrote:
---In [email protected], <awoelflebater@...> wrote :
---In [email protected], <noozguru@...> wrote :
On 05/24/2014 06:41 PM, awoelflebater@... <mailto:awoelflebater@...>
[FairfieldLife] wrote:
---In [email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>, <steve.sundur@...>
<mailto:steve.sundur@...> wrote :
Michael,
You just miss the point. I am no great TM defender. But you
start with a misguided notion of what the practice of TM is
capable of doing. And on that basis you make connections
about what problems can be attributed to the practice of TM.
There are many things I think are out of whack in regards the
TMO culture, but I know, from experience, with my own 21 year
old son, that this is a difficult period of ones life to
navigate, with or without the practice of TM.
And from my own difficult adolescence, the most the practice
of TM was able to do for me was give me a few minutes of
respite each day.
I would wager, (or at least hope), that any parent within the
TMO culture who felt they had a child at risk would take any
necessary steps to address that risk.
I knew the parents, or at least the father of the boy who
committed suicide a few years ago, Daniel S. He did not live
in any kind of fantasy world about TM.
You make this silly statement that if my beliefs are so
strong, I should consider working full time for the movement.
To me that points out a blind spot in that you seem to have
taken every claim made about TM at face value, never figuring
in a discount that most people would naturally take.
And when it fell short, you developed a vendetta.
This has been my point all along. I don't think it is about
taking the TM promises so literally - it is all so literal
how MJ is 'reading' these claims and then presenting them as
proof that TM doesn't work. It's almost as if he believes
that those who practice TM are incapable of making a mistake
or being sad or getting divorced. Come on. Get a grip. No one
believes that just by learning a meditation technique that
you are going to become super-human, infallible and perfect.
And no one is buying the fact that because a meditator has
decided to end their life that it completely invalidates the
entire TM practice and condemns the Movement as being one big
fraud. The world is never so black and white.
But that was the promise, do you remember the Science of
Being book? Apparently TM is better than psychiatry because
it solves problems on the level of the all powerful unified
field and not on the level of thoughts and emotions - which
are obviously shallow in comparison. This is standard SCI
thinking and TM teachers to this day will parrot it,
championing TM over regular therapies.
I think the trouble starts when people take Marshy and the
TMO at their word and ignore their own emotions, it's easy to
backtrack after a disaster and claim that it wasn't supposed
to be taken seriously but people do. As we all know, it isn't
/better/ than other therapies so they should scrap the
superiority complex and stop all this "invincibility" nonsense.
MJ isn't /reading /these claims anymore than I was when I
pointed out that someone going postal with an AK47 during a
World Peace Assembly doesn't /skew/ the results, it /is/ the
results.
The drug doesn't work so they should change the marketing
strategy to something a bit more realistic. It's not
unreasonable to say it.
Samskaras still will be there and play out even in
enlightenment. Otherwise enlightened people would just be a
blob doing nothing. Maharishi made a mistake giving the
impression that enlightened people would be perfect when
Indian philosophy says otherwise. Enlightened people just
experience things from a different perspective.
And just what is that supposed to mean? Is god still moving in
mysterious ways?
Your trouble is you want to have it all ways, he's the best
teacher ever when he's right but when he's wrong it's because
he has a different perspective? This is cognitive dissonance
in all its unfortunate and glory.
A wee bit of confusion here. MMY often just regurgitated standard
Indian yogic philosophy. Nothing wrong with that. Most westerners
weren't familiar with it. Whether he intended it or not however most
westerners got the idea that enlightened people would behave
"perfectly". They don't. What I said above is something that my tantra
guru pointed out and in a more obscure way so did MMY when he talked
about "remains of ignorance."
