--- In [email protected], Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Jun 15, 2006, at 8:03 AM, TurquoiseB wrote: > > --- In [email protected], Vaj <vajranatha@> wrote: > >> Unless of course she was pissed because she realized he was using > >> some form of suggestion... > >> > >> Some Buddhist teachers have suggested that Zen Master Rama was > >> just doing a form of "magical display" (if he was not hypnotizing > >> people)-- a kind of minor siddhi where they change people's > >> perceptions. Supposedly much easier to do and a lot more common > >> than actual levitation siddhi. > > > > Vaj, just out of curiosity, I'm going to ask you to back > > up this last paragraph by naming names. > > > > I'm asking not out of a desire to defend Rama but out of > > pure curiosity. I'm not convinced that you're telling > > the truth here, because I've encountered at least three > > dozen teachers in Tibetan traditions who have said no such > > thing about him. The worst that they said (and that I > > agree with wholeheartedly) is that he was a very high > > being who in the end succumbed to his own samskaras, > > and got taken out by his own attachments. No one I've > > spoken to has ever suggested that the siddhis he was > > able to perform were anything but real. > > > > See, the thing is that I happen to know that the Rama > > guy only met a handful of actual Tibetan teachers while > > he was still alive. I know all of these teachers and in > > general they are favorable towards him (with the caveat > > listed above, which I agree with). So I'm wondering which > > teachers you cite were willing to make such a state- > > ment about *someone they never met*. > > > > There are a *lot* of theories about 'hypnotism' and > > 'suggestion' floating around about Rama and the > > things he could do. But almost without exception > > *none* of the people suggesting these theories > > ever saw him in real life. So I'm asking you to > > 'name names' to see who would be so silly as to > > do this. > > If I can find the old email, I'll post it. IIRC these > weren't people who knew Zen Master Rama personally.
No, I didn't think so. I would also be willing to bet the farm that they never saw him in any of his public talks either. > I can see how a magical display would make more sense, esp. > if inner qualities were lacking. It makes sense if you weren't there. If you were there, it seems a lot like someone trying to cling to his preconceptions. :-) > Had any of this ever been witnessed by a trained magician > just out of curiosity? I have no idea. ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> Something is new at Yahoo! Groups. Check out the enhanced email design. http://us.click.yahoo.com/SISQkA/gOaOAA/yQLSAA/UlWolB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
