--- In [email protected], TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > There was nothing -- repeat, *nothing* -- in what > > > I wrote that suggested or even hinted at determinism. > > > > Point is, Barry, back then you were arguing > > *against* the idea that there was nothing one > > could do to become enlightened, and mocking it. > > Now you're arguing *for* it, and mocking the > > opposite idea. > > > > I don't care what you want to call it. I'm > > just pointing out that your perspective has > > changed rather drastically. > > No, actually, it hasn't. There is a *great* > deal one can do to facilitate the realization > of enlightenment. And to block its realization. > It's just that neither is the final determining > factor, just a factor.
If there are other factors involved than what you yourself can do, then realization is not "available at any time," which is what you've been claiming. > Get it now? > > > > In fact, it was specifically about the randomness > > > of the universe. > > > > You mean, the course of action is unfathomable, > > just as Krishna tells Arjuna in the Gita? > > > > I wouldn't call it "randomness," though, given > > what you say above about a "consensus result of > > the entire "set" of causes/actions." That sure > > ain't randomness. > > Yes it is. The composition of the "set" is random, > at every moment. Not if cause and effect is involved, it isn't. Not if "consensus" is involved, it isn't. Not if that consensus is a *result*, it isn't. > > > But I can see how it might comfort you to see deter- > > > minism all around you, even if it's not really there. > > > > And I can see how it might comfort you to think > > you're in total control. > > I *am* in total control of the things I do to > facilitate my realization of enlightenment. But > I am not silly enough to believe that's all there > is to it -- "Do X and Y will appear." There are > other factors that are not in my control Again, if that's the case, then realization is not "available at any time." Sometimes it is *not* available, if there are other factors involved over which you do not have control.
