Dave --
I think you're misunderstanding my point. I'm not saying that FG's MP server
should hold itself to the high standards of realistic air-traffic and
air-traffic-control that IVAO strives for. In fact, I'm saying completely the
opposite -- that bridging the two networks at the server level would be a
mistake, because many of the users who log onto FG-MP are not aiming for that
level of realism, and that if such a bridge were created, those who were
seeking less-than serious interaction would have to look elsewhere.
I do, however, think it's rude when the "kids" try to get everyone to "clear
the runway" by shouting in all caps, or participate in other intentionally
annoying behavior for the purpose of attempting to impede or infringe on on
what someone else is doing, or otherwise expect that everyone exists to help
them when they have expended no effort to help themselves. Maybe you and I fly
at different times of the day, but I think I see this with more frequency than
what you are characterizing.
But I guess I used these "extreme" examples to illustrate my point, leading to
the obscuring of my main objection to bridging the two server networks (which
is apparently now a moot point, as I don't believe that's the route the
proposal is taking anymore). At any rate I apologize for the confusion.
Cheers,
-R.
Robert M. Shearman, Jr.
Transit Operations Supervisor,
University of Maryland Department of Transportation
also known as [EMAIL PROTECTED]
________________________________
From: dave <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: FlightGear developers discussions <flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net>
Sent: Monday, November 17, 2008 9:57:30 PM
Subject: Re: [Flightgear-devel] FlightGear in IVAO network
Dear Rob,
>From your description it appears that I am one of those "kids". A 43
year old kid mind you. I am always polite to others on the MP system. I
sometimes perform stunts in unusual aircraft and show off just for a
laugh. I demonstrate what can be achieved with practise. I push the
flight envelope on occasion. What I do as well though, is encourage the
use of FG and Linux through my usage. I help those "kids" who say "how
do I fly a helicopter?" learn to fly a helicopter". I remind the "kids"
that this a shared realm and that people aren't required to follow
orders. Most of the people on there are good folk and treat each other
respectfully. I would rather have the less-than-serious "kids" use
FlightGear than alternatives and rather "kids" than a bunch of stiffs
who just don't approve because of their personal mind set. I think that
if you need to have serious, "trying to fly as realistically as
possible" events, then go ahead and organise more of them and publish a
code of conduct for those attending. Who knows? you could have it as
often as weekly. Weekend flightschool/control tower practise anyone?
I'll turn up and make you proud!
On the subject of IVAO, I think that even entertaining the idea of
closing access to the FG-MP server for IVAO is the tail wagging the dog.
The connection to IVAO should be the exceptional case, not the general one.
Getting to know FlightGear was/is not an easy experience and at least
some benefit of the doubt should be afforded to those who obviously
aren't at your level of familiarity/usage or have a different attitude
to FG in general. I suppose what I am trying to say is that your idea of
what FG is, may or may not be at all like what I see it as. People need
to remember what the "open" part of open source implies and what free
spirit is about as well.
While I am here, I thank you all for FG. Because of FG, not only do I
have have a great simulator (free too) I have learned to use blender and
am a long way into a new model to hand over one day should it past
muster. I am even considering dusting off the old coding me and diving
into the guts. Such a great gift, is FG, that I feel the need to
contribute and learn more to be able to do so as well as the need to
encourage and help others use it.
cheers,
Dave McLoughlin.
(Woddy)
Rob Shearman, Jr. wrote:
> I wrote:
> > It seems
> > that a large number (often, the majority) of FG-MP users are on the
> > network to mess around and socialize rather than participate in a
> > multi-aircraft scenario with any degree of realism.
>
> Arnt wrote:
> > ..my impression from what little I've seen here on this list,
> > (I haven't had time to join the fun), is our "social" MP
> > things are MP airshows and fly-ins, in the http://eaa.org/
> > and http://airventure.org/ style spirit.
>
> > ..these events fits nicely into RL air traffic in RL and I see no
> > problems with IVAO's serious relism traffic servers joining our
> > MP servers, {...}
>
> Those are the events that we "organize," and in the forum these are
> organized by a core group of mature, "semi-serious" aviators, who fly
> these events for social reasons but attempt to fly reasonably
> realistically throughout them.
>
> But those you don't see on the list, but who are online on the MP
> servers on a near-constant basis, are the "kids" (of variable age
> range, no doubt) whose idea of social flying is "EMERGENCY LANDING<
> EVERYBODY CLEAR THE RUNWAY!!!!@@@" or "CAN SOMEONE TELL ME HOW TO
> FLY>>??" and/or those that just loop around aimlessly seeking
> attention or try to pull off something "cool" flying a 787 like it
> were in an aerobatic display.
>
> Given the former, I agree that this presents no problem working with
> IVAO. How do we screen for the latter? Again I say that there would
> have to be two FG-MP networks; one connected with IVAO and one that
> isn't. Or, close FG-MP to only those who register for IVAO and plan
> to follow its guidelines, leaving the "kids" to play solo, or else
> privately set up their own FG-MP servers.
>
> Cheers,
> -R.
>
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