On 07/03/11 23:57, Andreas Delmelle wrote:
> 
> On 04 Mar 2011, at 12:25, Vincent Hennebert wrote:
> 
>> On 03/03/11 20:18, Andreas Delmelle wrote:
>>>
>>> Let's assume that this refers to the default/normal situation. After all, 
>>> we are quoting the _general_ fo:region-before definition (= where no 
>>> deviating reference-orientation has been specified on the region). I would 
>>> not believe anyone claiming that this definition was written with the 
>>> intention of covering all possible combinations of 
>>> reference-orientation/writing-mode.
>>
>> I’m not sure I’m following. The specification is supposed to cover all
>> cases, isnt’it?
> 
> Yes, the specification as a whole, but a general definition of a formatting 
> object is just that. It describes the regular behavior. In case the 
> properties default to their initial values, and some such. To get the full 
> picture of the possible effects of reference-orientation and writing-mode, 
> the property definitions are just as important, if not more so.
> 
>>> The general definition just states the normal behavior: if no deviating 
>>> reference-orientation has been specified, the region-reference-area will 
>>> have the same orientation as the viewport.
>>>
>>> The definition of reference-orientation (7.21.3) states that a value of 
>>> '90' means that "the reference-orientation of this *reference-area* is 
>>> rotated 90 degrees counter-clockwise from the reference-orientation of the 
>>> *containing reference-area*."
>>
>> Exactly. So the reference-orientation of the region-viewport-area is
>> rotated from the reference-orientation of the page-reference-area.
> 
> The reference-orientation of the region-reference-area is rotated with 
> respect to the containing page-reference-area. Where does it say 'viewport'?

A viewport-area /is/ a reference-area. See section 4.2.2.


>>> So, specifying reference-orientation="90" on the region rotates its 
>>> reference-area by 90 degrees from the page-reference-area. Nothing is said 
>>> about the viewport here, mind you.
>>
>> There is, see Section 6.4.15, “fo:region-before”:
>>    “The reference-orientation and writing-mode of the
>>    region-viewport-area are determined by the formatting object that
>>    generates the area (see 6.4.5 fo:page-sequence).”
> 
> By 'here', I meant the definition of the property value. 
> On the other hand: indeed! My point exactly. The reference-orientation of the 
> region-viewport-area is always the same as that of the page-reference-area. 
> Only the reference-orientation of the region-reference-area can deviate 
> further (as described, by combining reference-orientation on the region with 
> from-page-master-region() on the page-sequence). The new, rotated co-ordinate 
> system would hold only *inside* the region-viewport-area to determine the 
> dimensions and placement of the region-reference-area. On the outside, 
> "before" is not rotated, yet.

I am getting a little impatient because the above is in clear
contradiction with what is written in the spec. The topic is already
complex, I think it’s important to not add to the confusion by making
sure we are reading it properly. Would you mind backing your points with
references to the spec?

If we take the XSL-FO example I put in my first message:
• from Section 6.4.13, “fo:simple-page-master”
    “[The] reference-orientation [of the page-viewport-area]
    is set to ‘0’”
    “The reference-orientation of the page-reference-area [...] [is]
    determined by the [...] fo:page-sequence.”
  So the page-viewport-area has a reference-orientation of 0:
          Top
    Left      Right
        Bottom
  And the page-reference-area has a reference-orientation of 90. As
  explained in Section 7.21.3, “reference-orientation”, its
  reference-orientation “is rotated 90 degrees counter-clockwise from
  the reference-orientation of the [page-viewport-area]”:
     R
    T B
     L

• from Section 6.4.15, “fo:region-before”:
    “The reference-orientation [...] of the region-viewport-area [is]
    determined by the [...] fo:page-sequence”
    “The reference-orientation of the region-reference-area is set to
    ‘0’ and is, therefore, the same as the orientation established by
    the region-viewport-area.”
  So the reference-orientation of the region-viewport-area is rotated
  90° counter-clockwise from the reference-orientation of the containing
  reference-area, which is the page-reference-area (see section 6.4.5,
  “fo:page-sequence”: “The region-viewport-area children of such
  a page-reference-area...”):
     B
    R L
     T
  And, as explained in my first message, since the content-rectangle of
  an area uses the reference-orientation of that area, the description
  in Section 6.4.15 about how the content-rectangle should be positioned
  appears to be inconsistent.

  The reference-orientation of the region-reference-area is the same as
  the one from the region-viewport-area:
     B
    R L
     T


> Regards,
> 
> Andreas

Thanks,
Vincent

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