Don't know if you all saw this article in *Hyperallergic. *Its related,
however on a wider spectrum of artists:

https://hyperallergic.com/408558/over-1800-female-artists-and-art-workers-sign-letter-against-sexual-harassment/?utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Artists%20and%20Art%20Workers%20Sign%20Letter%20Against%20Sexual%20Harassment&utm_content=Artists%20and%20Art%20Workers%20Sign%20Letter%20Against%20Sexual%20Harassment+CID_9e2035daa86535d993a8c1d2c4325563&utm_source=HyperallergicNewsletter&utm_term=not-surprisedorg%20initiative

Mary B

On Mon, Nov 27, 2017 at 1:10 AM, lady snowblood <
snowbloods.para...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Thank you for your observations on the role of scholarship in creating
> centered spaces for auteurs Evan.
>
> When female filmmakers voices are centered, when I as a woman don’t have
> to decrypt and explain what is perfectly clear to me — I was raised
> literate in a male visual vocabulary (as is everyone in the culture). I am
> constantly doing double-work. When I don’t have to do that, then gender
> parity will have happened.
>
> I grew up trained to recognize male visual language, right? Double-work is
> “ok where is my vision of this, as it has been informed by my
> woman-experience”. It is what women say to other women when men aren’t
> around, what men miss or overlook. This is often the narrative I’m
> interested in. And that kind of narrative is often demoted because it
> literally can’t be seen.
>
> I can put on multiple lenses, I have practiced reading so many kinds of
> work by so many kinds of speakers. Yet the voice at center? Usually male
> auteur. The kind of work rewarded? Same.
>
> That place in the center allows the auteur the power to abuse those in the
> margins.
>
> To me the deepest revolution is to sponsor women’s authorial power, to
> bring queer authors, POC authors, to the center. Let many have a turn in
> that space. Lateralize the mountain, get rifle of ideas of apex. Train all
> in how to listen and prize story and voice coming from places “not white”,
> “not male”, etc.
>
> So many people are making work now, I gave up pederasts and stalkers and
> found new art old and new to research and consider. It’s not hard. I value
> Tippi Hedrin more than Alfred Hitchcock’s films, not a tough decision.
>
> I also keep the act of viewing art in balance with other areas of life - I
> have few idols and art isn’t an escape for me, rather it enriches my life.
> It’s not a church, either, it’s part of our built world.
>
> I also have listened to too many women (and a smaller number of men) who
> have been assaulted. That pain is real, the day to say struggle, often too
> much.  Art? It’s an illusion. Created in a more conscious way than our
> mutual traumas, so much of trauma a boiling-over of uncontrollability and
> attempts to control.
>
> Anyway ... I have worked with survivor communities training in fine art
> production, it is something we should keep talking about. Certainly it’s
> not one answer coming from ‘out there’ that gets us to figure out, each one
> of us, what might work. It’s a gigantic constellation of conversations and
> ongoing discussion and failing and trying again.
>
> Thanks for bringing this up. It’s a valuable convo to have.
>
> Jessica
>
> * * * * *
>
> Jessica Fenlon
>
> artist : poet : experimental : http://sixth-station.com
>
> flickr <https://www.flickr.com/photos/drawclose> : vimeo
> <http://vimeo.com/jessicafenlon> : instagram
> <https://www.instagram.com/port.manteaux>
>
> On Nov 26, 2017, at 12:31 AM, Amanda Christie <
> ama...@amandadawnchristie.ca> wrote:
>
> I would like to offer another perspective, that no one has mentioned yet…
> about when it comes to naming names…
> and the idea that Evan mentioned about the voiceless gaining a voice…
>
> if a third party names names… are the voiceless actually gaining a voice
> if they are not the ones telling their own stories?
> or is someone else then telling their story for them, and thus stealing
> their voice again?
>
>
> there is more complexity to this situation than just what to do with the
> art of an aggressor after an aggressor has been outed…
> there is also the question of how the outing of an aggressor then impacts
> the actual people who were hurt and whether or not they are the ones
> telling their own stories.
> I think that is the most important question in all of this.
> Consideration for the people who were hurt and making sure that they
> retain their own right to choose whether or not to tell their own stories.
>
>
> naming aggressors should come from the people who have personally been
> hurt by them… (I don’t want to use the term “victim", or “survivor",
> because i find those terms put the person who lived the experience, into a
> labelled box where their whole identity becomes about the aggression they
> lived through, rather than all of the other things they accomplished in
> their life… but i can’t think of better terms right now, so i will
> reluctantly use those terms in this instance).
>
>
> So... let’s say someone does name people… what about the victims or
> survivors… do they have a say in that?
> if he outs them… then, no. they don’t.  and they become revictimized again.
> Even if their own names are not mentioned as “victims” or “survivors"…
> seeing their aggressors named, may out them anyway… because this is a very
> small community.
>
>
> and I think that it is problematic when we become so focussed on outing
> people, for the greater cause… that we forget about the impact it might
> have on the individual people who actually experienced the aggressions,
> that are then forced to relive traumatic experiences without having
> prepared themselves for it… or who then have to have their own art work or
> past films defined by those experiences rather than by the work itself.
>
> in addition to potentially further victimizing those who were already
> hurt… i think that naming names risks becoming a simplistic distraction
> from actually discussing the issues and finding strategies for moving
> forward….
>
>
> which brings me to the other issue, which i think is of critical
> importance in this particular context of esoteric experimental films made
> in the margins…
>
>
> as Pip said… this is not the industry… there are no casting couches… but
> still… precisely because this is a small community, making esoteric
> non-commercial works… it makes it that much harder for people to come
> forward with stories… why?  because, our experimental films have such a
> small audience to begin with… and while there is some critical and academic
> writing about these films… it is still limited… so, if someone comes
> forward with a story about surviving an assault or an aggression while
> making a film… then later on, if their work ever gets written about… that
> aggression or assault becomes a part of the public narrative of their work…
> perhaps even tied to a particular film… basically, if someone shares about
> such an experience… they risk having the story of their assault hijack the
> public and historical narrative of their film, because then whenever people
> write about that film… they don’t just write about the film itself… they
> might write about the “obstacles” that were overcome when making the film…
> the “survivor” story… all of a sudden the film itself gets lost as it
> becomes a vehicle to advance the greater cause of sexual equality,which is
> a good cause… however... as such, the film itself (the one made by the
> victim or the survivor) risks getting lost or overshadowed in the process
> of telling the story of the aggression…. and the filmmaker is then reduced
> to either a victim or a survivor, instead of being treated simply as a
> filmmaker…  so then there is the dilemma… does a person share the story,
> for the greater good in order to promote progress and end rape culture, and
> therefore, in the process of so doing, risk having their artwork hijacked,
> because opening that narrative essentially gives back power to their
> aggressors, because the story of the aggression will then quite likely
> overshadow the film itself?…
>
> why do i say the story of the aggression may overshadow the story of the
> film itself?  precisely because our films are experimental and esoteric in
> nature… made for a small audience… meanwhile stories of sexual assault are
> (dare i say it) sexy and scandalous and people love juicy stories and
> gossip…
>
> these stories of assault have wider public appeal than experimental films…
> and so a filmmaker making small experimental films on the margins… who
> shares a story about assault that happened while making a film… risks the
> possibility that the film gains a wider audience… not because of anything
> inherent in the film itself…. but rather because of the drama of the story…
> and thus, in a sense, the aggressors take the film from the artist who was
> assaulted… when they have probably already taken enough from that artist as
> it is… (when i say the aggressors take the film from the artist… i mean in
> the sense that the story of the assault, hijacks any critical discussion or
> interpretation of the film itself, because people focus on the conditions
> of the making of the film and the assault, instead… essentially, public
> narrative of the film is hijacked)”…  the aggressors should not be allowed
> to take the artist’s film from them as well…. they shouldn’t be allowed to
> have that too.
>
>
> so, i’m not sure if all of this is coming across clearly… but i think it
> is very very important… especially in a milieu where our work is esoteric
> and our audiences are small… and writing about our work is limited… that we
> make sure to be careful about who gets to tell their own stories.
>
>
> when you out an aggressor… you may also be outing a victim or a survivor
> who might not want to be outed… because they might prefer that their films
> and their artwork to stand on its own merit… and not be hijacked by a
> terrible experience… they might not want to relive something… they might
> not want those stories showing up in historical texts written about them…
> they might not want to talk about those stories every time they are
> interviewed about a certain film or during every Q&A after that film
> screens… these stories don’t only impact the reading the work of the
> aggressors… they also impact the reading of the films made by the victims
> and survivors…
>
>
> so yeah… i think it is very important to be careful when naming names… to
> look at the bigger picture… not just the picture of the greater good and
> progress and moving forward and ending rape culture…  because ending rape
> culture also includes consideration for the individuals that were actually
> hurt by the aggressors… their personal mental and psychological states… and
> the impact that these stories might have on the public reception of their
> works and potential future writing about their work.
>
>
> it’s important to think of the impact it will have on the individuals who
> were hurt… and to think about who has the right to tell whose story.
>
> my two cents.
>
> adc
>
>
> On Nov 25, 2017, at 8:23 PM, Evan Greene <evan.michael.gre...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>
> Fred,
>
>
> While I agree is a lot more complicated of a situation. I was writing out
> a whole long response talking about Gauguin, Picasso, and other toxic male
> artists among other things when I decided to revisit your website and
> noticed a few things:
>
>
> 1) your list of what you consider the greatest films of all time include
> no female filmmakers.
>
>
> 2) your list of what you consider the greatest filmmakers of all time is
> almost entirely male.
>
>
> 3) almost all of your writing on film you have linked on your site is
> about male filmmakers.
>
>
> Honestly I find this kind of weird too considering you’ve written so much
> on Brakhage and three of the most influential filmmakers on him we’re all
> women. Deren, Menken, Schneemann. All of whom are notably absent from your
> lists.
>
>
> While I somewhat understand your reasoning not to name names it seems that
> it also could be read that you’re trying to keep your version of cinematic
> history untainted.
>
>
> We live in a different world now.
>
> What was once acceptable and commonplace isn’t anymore.
>
> The voiceless are starting to gain a voice.
>
>
> 😎
>
>
> On Nov 25, 2017, at 3:15 PM, Chuck Kleinhans <chuck...@northwestern.edu>
> wrote:
>
>
> Sum Bodi and Evan Greene,
>
>
> In making the initial post on this discussion thread, I was thinking of
> the general topic of sexual harassment, not calling out individual people.
> I think the discussion has tended to go that way, broadening out at times
> to discuss sexism in general in the experimental art world.
>
>
> I agree with Fred that it is not appropriate to name names here for
> several reasons: much of the “knowledge” is hearsay, a free for all social
> media listserv is not a forum with any protections for all the parties who
> might be concerned (accuser, accused, bystanders, spouses/partners,
> children, the  framing institutions, etc.), and different people draw “the
> line” in different places for inappropriate behavior. As much as possible,
> I think the goal should be restorative justice.
>
>
> At least in educational institutions today we have (some) formal Title IX
> policies and procedures in place (as flawed as that system may be, and as
> determined that the Trump administration is to weaken them). For a
> particularly lucid discussion of these controversies I’d recommend
> filmmaker/critic Laura Kipnis’s new book, Unwanted Advances: Sexual
> Paranoia Comes to Campus.
>
>
> Earlier Pip argued that because so much of experimental filmmaking is done
> in an individual artisan way there aren’t the same workplace hierarchies as
> in the commercial film world.  True, but anytime there are power
> differentials, abuse is possible: that may be in funding, access to
> equipment, necessary services, distribution, exhibition, curating, and even
> archiving and preservation. And criticism and recognition.  Our field,
> after all ranges from the first year student showing a short work at the
> end of the semester class screening to yet another mammoth Mathew Barney
> extravaganza at a major museum.
>
>
> Chuck Kleinhans
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> FrameWorks mailing list
>
> FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com
>
> https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> FrameWorks mailing list
>
> FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com
>
> https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> FrameWorks mailing list
> FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com
> https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> FrameWorks mailing list
> FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com
> https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks
>
>


-- 





www.marybillyou.com
_______________________________________________
FrameWorks mailing list
FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com
https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks

Reply via email to