On 2017-03-06 14:10, Lukas Slebodnik wrote:
> On (06/03/17 13:49), Tomas Krizek wrote:
>> On 03/06/2017 01:44 PM, Lukas Slebodnik wrote:
>>> On (06/03/17 13:35), Tomas Krizek wrote:
>>>> On 03/03/2017 09:22 PM, Rob Crittenden wrote:
>>>>> Lukas Slebodnik wrote:
>>>>>> On (03/03/17 17:07), Lukas Slebodnik wrote:
>>>>>>> ehlo,
>>>>>>> This is a small continuation fo discussin from pull request
>>>>>>> "Make pylint and jsl optional" #502[1]
>>>>>>> Pylint and jslint are already optional because some downstream 
>>>>>>> distributions
>>>>>>> does not have such packages. This is a reason why desing document[2]
>>>>>>> mention configuration options for disabling them.
>>>>>>>   --disable-pylint --without-jslint
>>>>>>> Previusly (4.4) "pylint was executed" before building rpm packages.
>>>>>>> This strict requirement was changed because "make lint" is executed
>>>>>>> with each pull request in travis.
>>>>>>> It was changed in commits
>>>>>>> master:
>>>>>>> * 5c18feaa206bbaee692fc3640b7b79c8d9d6a638 CONFIGURE: Fix detection of 
>>>>>>> pylint
>>>>>>> * 3f91469f327d8d9f3b27e0b67c54a4f47ad845c1 CONFIGURE: Update help 
>>>>>>> message for jslint
>>>>>>> * b82d285a4a75e11cc9291ecca12d2fcc26f43ed1 SPEC: Fix build in mock
>>>>>>> The main intention of PR#502 [1] is to make it even more optional
>>>>>>> and do not fail if pylint is not installed on machine.
>>>>>>> In another words, changing default value from "yes" to "autodetect".
>>>>>>> I think the main reason is that it is not obvious that it is an optional
>>>>>>> dependency if you run just "./configure". But that can be improved with
>>>>>>> better error message. @see attachments.
>>>>> I was going to go into a history of why it was required (we pushed
>>>>> broken changes into master) but in retrospect that doesn't really
>>>>> matter. I've been out of mainline development for some time so don't
>>>>> know your current processes, but I do have a question:
>>>>> Is it expected that ./configure && make && make install will result in
>>>>> the bits in all the right places? We never had that expectation before
>>>>> though I know Christian has been moving in that direction. Is that an
>>>>> end goal? It would be nice for developing in-tree and pushing out micro
>>>>> changes onto the current, live development system.
>>>> If you provide correct paths to ./configure, yes - make && make install
>>>> will place all the bits in the right places. I commonly use it with
>>>> DESTDIR and sshfs, so I can develop locally and deploy to a remote
>>>> machine without building RPMs.
>>>>> If so, does it have checks for all the runtime dependencies or will you
>>>>> still have to do a bunch of work afterward the make install?
>>>> It doesn't check runtime dependencies. I install the freeipa rpms once
>>>> to install dependencies and then use make && make install.
>>>>> I've seen discussions about making freeIPA more accessible to the
>>>>> average developer, which is good, but it is just so more complex than
>>>>> the typical software because it is more about integration than most big
>>>>> projects. So I don't know that this is every going to really be true.
>>>>> Will it help the average dev install it? Sure, but then what? Will you
>>>>> support such an install?
>>>>> If you want to disable the checks for *lint that is certainly your
>>>>> prerogative but I see some downsides:
>>>>> - I used to setup new dev systems all the time and this is definitely
>>>>> something I'd forget to do with some frequency
>>>>> - As I understand it the checks will be executed by upstream before a
>>>>> change is accepted so that's good but it adds a huge delay and the
>>>>> requirement of a roundtrip to fix simple mistakes (happens all the time
>>>>> in OpenStack).
>>>> On-PR checks can handle this. When you need to fix a linter issue, you
>>>> can install the dependencies and run make lint locally.
>>>>> I think my question boils down to how many people will this actually
>>>>> benefit vs how much time will be lost resubmitting patches? I don't
>>>>> think there is an easy answer for the first part but from my own
>>>>> experience I'd expect fairly regularly for lint and pep8 errors.
>>>> If someone often has this issue, the workflow can be modified to address
>>>> it. For example, I've configured my repo to run to run pylint and pep8
>>>> on the modified files before the commit.
>>>>> On the other hand I guess this also will have the additional advantage
>>>>> that make rpms will be significantly faster if you don't enable them.
>>>>> The --disable vs --without is what bugs me most about the current
>>>>> situation :-)
>>>>> So in closing I'd just say that we made those checks mandatory for a
>>>>> reason. Maybe that reason is no longer applicable with all the current
>>>>> automation but I'd personally prefer Lukas's suggestion of requiring
>>>>> them by default but providing clear output on how to disable them if
>>>>> desired. This way the average user can easily work around it and it
>>>>> won't impact current developers (unless they want it to). Is that as
>>>>> simple as configure; make; make install? No, but it isn't a huge leap
>>>>> either.
>>>>> rob
>>>> I prefer Christian's approach that makes the project more 
>>>> upstream-friendly.
>>> Could you explain what does "more upstream-friendly" mean?
>>> It seems that we have different opinion what does it mean.
>> For me, it means making the project easier to develop and install,
>> without the need to check ./configure options or having to look for and
>> install optional dependencies.
> I am sorry but I still did not get your point. Could you a little bit
> ellaborate?
> And few related questions to the statement "easier to develop and install"
> A) All server part is optional. Does it mean that we should disabling server 
> by
> default or autodetect all server dependencies and do not build server if they
> are missing?

Exaggeration is a stylistic device, but that's taking it a bit too far.

> B) it is not just an optional dependency. I tried to explain in 1st mail
> that it should be a recomended dependency.

Recommended != required

Linting is a recommended tool for development. It's a totally optional
thing for building and installing FreeIPA. The RPM spec is the best
proof for that. Linting is not even a required tool for development. CI
takes care of linting.

> C) Could you explain how it will be easier to develop on debian/other
> distribution if upstream does not recommend to run "make lint".

My PR does not discourage `make lint`.


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