Nick -
Good point, however we all probably agree that hyperbole is as common on
this list as is cynicism.
I actually find myself leaving my driveway less and less... but not
because I think anyone is out to get me, but in fact, as you point out,
I'm more and more aware how much of a S--T no one gives?
I think one of the things that motivated me in my youth around riding a
motorcycle was the actual exhiliration I felt every time I anticipated
some numbskull's poor judgement or execution... I feel something
somewhat different now. Especially realizing that as often as not, I
*don't* anticipate them all.
- Steve
D.
Argumentative positioning aside, you could not get out your drive way
if you actually believed any of that. In the first place, the world
isn't interested in harming you. That's the hardest part. REAllizing
that they don't love you AND they don't hate you. THEY JUST DON'T
GIVE A S---T.
n
*From:*[email protected] [mailto:[email protected]]
*On Behalf Of *Prof David West
*Sent:* Monday, September 24, 2012 10:21 AM
*To:* The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group
*Subject:* Re: [FRIAM] faith
As another rider (only 44 years) - my faith is that every other driver
out there is incompetent, blind, deaf, and out to get me. I credit
that faith with my continuing existence!
davew
On Sun, Sep 23, 2012, at 06:23 PM, Douglas Roberts wrote:
Yeah, well: that philosophy will get you dead if you are a
motorcycle rider. Maybe not the first year, but the longer you
maintain "faith" that the other diver will stay in his lane, the
more likely it becomes that you won't make it home one night.
I've been riding for 48 years, still alive...
--Doug
On Sun, Sep 23, 2012 at 6:13 PM, ERIC P. CHARLES <[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
Since this thread is still going... Curt said:
"Faith: that the other drivers will stay on their side of the
road. I don't have to track every one exactly."
----
Exactly!
It is faith when you stop monitoring the other cars when driving,
stop looking at the ground you are about to step on when walking,
etc. It is faith when you get out of bed without checking to see
that the ground is still there. The actions themselves entail the
faith; they do not result from faith, they are the faith. An
interesting additional issue is when we do and do not explicitly
talk about the things we have faith in. It might also be an
additional issue on what basis some people have faith in a
"super-natural" "higher-power". (Both scare-quotes seem necessary,
because pretty everyone has faith in higher powers, and most
people have faith in things they don't have natural explanations
for, but we seem to be focusing primarily on the times when those
faiths overlap.)
Eric
P.S. Curt, if you are into Power's Perceptual Control Theory, do
you know Richard Marken and Warren Manell's work? They wrote a
great article for a journal issue I am putting together.
P.P.S. The notion of "blind" faith is really very modern.
Certainly it was not long ago that faith in the Judeo-Christian
God was primarily supported by experiential evidence. "Behold the
wonders," "experience God in every blade of grass," "check out
this amazing cathedral," "our army won," etc. The fact that we
sometimes meaningfully talk about "blind faith" seems to indicate
that the normal meaning of the term "faith" is not inherently blind.
On Fri, Sep 21, 2012 12:21 AM, *Curt McNamara <[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>>* wrote:
I had been nicely ignoring this thread in the belief (faith?)
that it would go away without affecting me. Alas, the need for
a distraction from grading has drawn me back into its basin of
(strange) attraction.
Faith: that the other drivers will stay on their side of the
road. I don't have to track every one exactly.
Action based on belief: ref. William Powers: Behavior, the
Control of Perception.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perceptual_control_theory
Faith or belief: my mental models of the world will still be
true tomorrow. These models have been built over time by
hypothesis, testing, and adjustment (toddler and stairs example).
Curt
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------------
Eric Charles
Assistant Professor of Psychology
Penn State University
Altoona, PA 16601
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Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
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--
Doug Roberts
[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>
[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>
http://parrot-farm.net/Second-Cousins
505-455-7333 - Office
505-670-8195 - Cell
============================================================
FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org
============================================================
FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org
============================================================
FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv
Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org
