N This make me feel sad:
If Nancy Hanks came back as a ghost, seeking news of what she loved most, she'd ask first, "Where's my son? What's happened to Abe? What's he done?" "Poor little Abe, left all alone, Except for Tom, who's a rolling stone; He was only nine, the year I died. I still remember how hard he cried." You know the rest. I'm the de facto father of a nine year-old boy, as you know. And Friday is Abe's birthday. F On Tue, Feb 9, 2021 at 12:50 PM <[email protected]> wrote: > F > > > > And what is the feeler you are using when you feel them and what exactly > is that feeler feeling? I assume your answer will be that you are using > your feeling feeler and what the feeling feeler is feeling is feelings. > (};-)] > > > > N > > > > PS Glen (at least) is going to dope-slap us for having in public the same > stupid argument again. But I do so enjoy it. > > > > Nick Thompson > > [email protected] > > https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/ > > > > *From:* Friam <[email protected]> *On Behalf Of *Frank Wimberly > *Sent:* Tuesday, February 9, 2021 1:41 PM > *To:* The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group < > [email protected]> > *Subject:* Re: [FRIAM] The Hidden Spring: A Journey to the Source of > Consciousness by Mark Solms > > > > Emotions are what I feel. > > --- > Frank C. Wimberly > 140 Calle Ojo Feliz, > Santa Fe, NM 87505 > > 505 670-9918 > Santa Fe, NM > > > > On Tue, Feb 9, 2021, 12:31 PM <[email protected]> wrote: > > I might agree with Burkerman here, if we understand emotions/motives as > assessments of the relation between what I need and the ability of my > environment to provide it. > > Thanks, all. > > n > > Nick Thompson > [email protected] > https://wordpress.clarku.edu/nthompson/ > > -----Original Message----- > From: Friam <[email protected]> On Behalf Of u?l? ??? > Sent: Tuesday, February 9, 2021 1:13 PM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [FRIAM] The Hidden Spring: A Journey to the Source of > Consciousness by Mark Solms > > Thanks so much for posting this, Russ! I finally got around to the > Guardian article. I'm at risk for confirmation bias because I tend to think > consciousness is a lossy, multivalent compression of interoceptive > composites. And the extent to which one can [⛧] feel what it's like to be > some (other) thing depends fundamentally on whether or not you a) have > similar elemental interoceptive pathways, b) whether they compose in a > similar way, and c) compress to a similar result. That allows for a > spectrum of similarity from extremes of, say, a rock to a bat to another > human. > > In any case, it's on the wishlist: > https://bookshop.org/books/the-hidden-spring-a-journey-to-the-source-of-consciousness/9780393542011 > > > [⛧] Feeling like something else is subtly different from *inferring* how > something else feels (or from being manipulated into similar feelings). > > On 2/6/21 5:15 PM, Russ Abbott wrote: > > About to be published. > > > > From a review < > https://www.theguardian.com/books/2021/feb/05/the-hidden-spring-by-mark-solms-review-the-riddle-of-consciousness-solved> > by Oliver Burkeman: > > > > Burkeman: Using poignant case studies of neurology patients – including > children born with brain damage, yet plainly still capable of sadness and > joy – [Solms] argues persuasively that consciousness ultimately arises not > in the cortex, the seat of advanced intelligence, but in the more primitive > brainstem, where basic emotions begin. > > > > Russ: In other words, consciousness exists far down the tree of life. > > > > Burkeman: To the best of my understanding, the gist [of the book] is > > that feelings are a uniquely effective and efficient way for humans to > monitor their countless changing biological needs, in extremely > unpredictable environments, to set priorities for action and make the best > choices so as to remain within various bounds – of hunger, cold and heat, > physical danger, social isolation, etc – outside of which we can’t survive > for long. Doing all that without feelings, and doing it as rapidly as > survival requires, would take so many computational resources that it would > lead to a “combinatorial explosion”, demanding levels of energy a human > could never muster. > > > > Here's Nick Lane's blurb on Amazon > > <https://www.amazon.com/Hidden-Spring-Journey-Source-Consciousness/dp/ > > 0393542017/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_product_top?ie=UTF8>: (If you know Nick > > Lane, you know he is worth listening to.) > > > > "At last the emperor has found some clothes! For decades, consciousness > has been perceived as an epiphenomenon, little more than an illusion that > can't really make things happen. Solms takes a thrilling new approach to > the problem, grounded in modern neurobiology but finding meaning in older > ideas going back to Freud. This is an exciting book." > > ― Nick Lane, author of /The Vital Question/ > > -- > ↙↙↙ uǝlƃ > > - .... . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. .... . .-. . > FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv > Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam un/subscribe > http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com > FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ > archives: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ > > > - .... . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. .... . .-. . > FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv > Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam > un/subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com > FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ > archives: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ > > - .... . -..-. . -. -.. -..-. .. ... -..-. .... . .-. . > FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv > Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn GMT-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam > un/subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com > FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ > archives: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ > -- Frank Wimberly 140 Calle Ojo Feliz Santa Fe, NM 87505 505 670-9918 Research: https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Frank_Wimberly2
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