Hello Jeremy and all,
Jeremy I agree with everything you said. I'm not a dev myself, though
I have ideas what I lack is time. I do feel that the points you raised
about being taken seriously are accurate and very valid. To many times
I've seen blind individuals, even coworkers badger someone like as you
say a child, and the reaction I get is to be treated like that child,
even though I was not involved and am separate, as a community we are
judged by the sighted. It's the case of the bad apple, maybe not the
best analogy but in this case I feel that one bad impression hurts us
all.
Here's something that happened to me that I feel might illustrate the
point of public impressions. A group of blind individuals about 20,
including myself went out to dinner at a pizza place. This place you
had to go up to the counter, place your order, which was across an
open room you couldn't miss it, then get it and eat. Tables were on
one side counter on the other. We all sat down at various tables and
started eating. There were sighted in the place and they looked on us
with horror and revolusion because many in the group were loud,
throwing things, and in general eating like slobs. The separate group
about six of us, were separated from the first group by two tables and
were retrieving and eating our orders properly. Did it matter? No, It
did not. We were all viewed under the same microscope.
Thomas made a point about educating the sighted community a little at
a time. That's hard, a daily task and something that we all do when we
do something as simple as go up independently to a store teller and
independently complete a transaction.
I agree also with all that's been said and it applies to not only
games but to other products as well. Even if something wasn't
specifically designed for "the blind" which means it's marked at a
commercial price, but it happens to work for the blind for myself I
heap praise on it's makers, and explain that they have done a great
service in producing their product. And maybe that developer will go
on and make another product, that works just because of constructive
positive feedback. Perception is everything.
I hope that this has given some food for thought.
Dave.
On 12/17/11, Charles Rivard <wee1s...@fidnet.com> wrote:
> As is being found out through this thread, it isn't only the sighted people
> who notice, and probably judge us, on our ability to accurately communicate
> through Emails. Blind people cannot decipher a lot of messages that were
> written by screen reader users because they weren't punctuated or correctly
> spelled.
>
> A screen reader, JAWS for example, will put pauses and inflection into
> messages as indicated by how they were written.. A lack of punctuation
> indicates one sentence that runs on, and on, and on! The screen reader
> pronounces it how it sees it. Funy isn't funny, and pupy isn't puppy. If
> you listen to your message before you send it, you should hear this
> mistakes, and you should go back over your message and correct them. Nobody
> will even know you made the mistakes, but if you leave them in, people will
> notice. And, when someone constructively criticizes you by showing that
> puzle should be puzzle, for example, it's not being picky. It's trying to
> be helpful. On the other side of the coin, screen readers can be strange at
> times. Videogame is correct, even though it should be pronounced "video
> game", so, at times, it does pay to pay attention when reading, keeping in
> mind that screen readers are not perfect.
>
> When it comes to proofreading, those of us fortunate enough to have a
> refreshable braille display can usually do a better job at it, because
> braille is the best and most immediate and accurate method. It can be done
> with speech, but just takes a bit more time and effort, but it still doesn't
> take all that much.
>
> ---
> Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Mich" <mi...@eastlink.ca>
> To: "Gamers Discussion list" <gamers@audyssey.org>
> Sent: Saturday, December 17, 2011 10:07 AM
> Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Blind Gamers Being Taken Seriously?
>
>
>> Hi I agree with this as well. I will go one step further and admit that my
>>
>> spelling is not grate either. thank goodness for spell check. and I also
>> agree that I to have shot off messages before with out spell checking them
>>
>> first. so I can sertenley understand where a sighted person would come off
>>
>> with the wrong idea about blind people if they are reading a message full
>> of spelling mistakes. well these are my thoughts. from Mich.
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Bryan Peterson" <bpeterson2...@cableone.net>
>> To: "Gamers Discussion list" <gamers@audyssey.org>
>> Sent: Saturday, December 17, 2011 10:10 AM
>> Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Blind Gamers Being Taken Seriously?
>>
>>
>>>I agree. I'll be the first to admit I've probably more than occasionally
>>>shot off such messages but I like to think I generally at least try to
>>>proofread beforehand because I'd much rather be understood than do the
>>>"convenient" thing and have someone go what? because my message wasn't
>>>understood. It's why, as I said in another topic, I absolutely refuse to
>>>use internet shorthand even while texting. And as a contributor to the
>>>Game FAQs web site it always set my teeth on edge when I'd get an Email
>>>that said something like Plz help me w Lufia. i cant kill the boss. Thx 4
>>>your time.
>>> They're coming to take me away, ha-haaa!
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Thomas Ward" <thomasward1...@gmail.com>
>>> To: "Gamers Discussion list" <gamers@audyssey.org>
>>> Sent: Saturday, December 17, 2011 7:49 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Blind Gamers Being Taken Seriously?
>>>
>>>
>>>> Hi Jeremy,
>>>>
>>>> Yes, you definitely raise some very good points in your message. As
>>>> you pointed out the biggest problem in communicating with sighted
>>>> developers and the public at large is ignorance on their part. Most
>>>> sighted people have never met a blind person before, and even if they
>>>> have there is no way of knowing what their experience was if any. Its
>>>> our job to correct their impressions through by educating them a step
>>>> at a time, and to do it in a way that makes us look like intelligent,
>>>> competent, and mature individuals who have something worthwhile to say
>>>> about their products and services.
>>>>
>>>> Its for that reason every time I see a poorly written message on
>>>> Audyssey or some other access list I inwardly cringe. I can't tell you
>>>> how many blind individuals just shoot off a message filled with poor
>>>> grammar, lack of proper punctuation, and spelling errors. Like it or
>>>> not if a sighted person reads those messages we will be judged one and
>>>> all as not very intelligent, as lacking communication skills, etc.
>>>> Bottom line, if we want the mainstream public's respect we have to
>>>> work for it, and not forgo proper language and writing skills for
>>>> convenience sake.
>>>>
>>>> Here at Audyssey we considered adding proofreading to the list
>>>> guidelines to improve the quality and clarity of the posts.
>>>> Unfortunately, there were some individuals that took serious offense
>>>> to that, and felt that the moderators were going too far. All I can
>>>> draw from their reaction is they don't care about being taken
>>>> seriously and want the rest of the sighted world to view us
>>>> negatively, because that's exactly what will happen if they send a
>>>> poorly written message to a person or company who has no experience
>>>> with the blind. In short, good communication skills will go a long
>>>> ways to bridging the gap between the blind and sighted communities.
>>>>
>>>> Cheers!
>>>>
>>>> ---
>>>> Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org
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>>>>
>>>
>>>
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>>
>>
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>
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