Well written and I agree with everything said here. My original
impression was that entirely browser based games would be
excluded from the list, though my personal opinion on who makes
the best games didn't match the site's. Thus, while I believe
that Alter Aeon and swamp should be some of the top games, that
is likely due to the fact that currently those are the only two
I'm seriously playing. I was also surprised to see GMA not near
the top, but I suppose that there are lots of opinions on best
out there.
----- Original Message -----
From: Che <blindadrenal...@gmail.com
To: Gamers Discussion list <gamers@audyssey.org
Date sent: Tue, 20 Dec 2011 14:44:09 -0600
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Top 25 websites for gamers who are blind
yes, I can see where a line needs to be drawn if your
considering top
sites for blind gamers.
To me, the online thing shouldn't matter, what should matter
is if
the site offers games produced mainly for the blind, whether they
are
played online or not.
Web based games such as Core Exiles and so forth are games
that
happen to be accessible because they are browser based, maybe
with a
few accessible bits thrown in.
This is not the case with BA, Quinten's playroom or RS games.
Although these all offer games played on the internet, they
are all
games designed for the blind, not games designed for the general
public
that happen to be playable by those with screenreaders.
Of course, every game out there that happens to be playable
by the
blind cannot be properly reviewed by such a small staff for
inclusion on
such a list, but the sites that are developing computer games
basically
exclusively for the blind should be recognized for their efforts,
and
not lumped in with a bunch of offerings designed for the general
public
that just happen to be accessible as an afterthought.
Eleanor has fallen quiet on the issue here, so perhaps their
mind is
made up on the topic, but if so, it is a shame they aren't taking
input
from the community on this, as I get the impression they are
missing the
point some of us are trying to make big time.
If she is simply waiting to see what others have to say on the
issue,
thats great, and I look forward to hearing from her.
No list of top sites is going to make that much of a
difference one
way or another frankly, but it would be a shame to see deserving
work
not get a bit of recognition because the powers that be might be
mis
informed about some of these sites out there.
Bottom line, what is the purpose of posting a top 25 list, and
is
that purpose served by dismissing games designed by the blind,
for the
blind, just because their main mode of play happens to be against
other
human beings via the internet. No less fun is had with these
games, no
less work is put into their creation, and in fact doing multi
player
adds a level of complexity most non programmers cannot fathom.
If I were to take the ability to play other human beings out
of my
games, would they then qualify for the top 25 list? Because if
so,
almost all of my games can be played as is single player that
way, but
this seems really silly to have to strip out a major component of
a game
so it can qualify as good enough for anything, when the option is
there
for you to play it that way.
The exclusion of these sites just makes absolutely no sense to
me,
and I don't think I'm alone here.
Again, I can see not including web based games, and even most
muds
though I think Alter Eon should be an exception given the amount
of work
put towards allowing the blind to be immersed in the game, but to
dismiss a site because it makes games for the blind that also are
playable online is just illogical to say the least..
Let me say this as well. Swamp, which by most accounts is a
frontrunner candidate for accessible game of the year would not
make
this list given the current guidelines, , as it can be played
online.
Will the impact it has had on the gaming community be dismissed
because
it is played online, and if not, what is the difference between
swamp,
castaways, and other games jeremy has made, and the games RS
Games,
Quentin's Playroom and BA have to offer?
Thoughts?
Che
On 12/20/2011 1:50 PM, dark wrote:
Hi Dennis.
i believe the "online games" mentioned doesn't mean games that
have some
online capability, but games that are entirely online, such as
brouser
games and yes, muds.
If the top 25 list included all the online text games that blind
people
can play well that's a catagory in itself, pluss it's then hard
to
separate out games that have been adaptated or altered for blind
players
vs those that just happen to be accessible.
that's why i see the point of excluding most online games, even
including those I like such as Core exiles.
Alteraeon though is I think the exception to this rule.
other muds like New worlds, materiamagica and avatar muds have
"some
features for blind or vi players" but alteraeon goes way beyond
the call
of duty here with what it does with atmospheric and adapted text
like
the weather descriptions, and is as I said tantamount to an
audio rpg
with the mushclient pack as well.
Beware the Grue!
Dark.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Dennis Towne" <s...@xirr.com
To: "Gamers Discussion list" <gamers@audyssey.org
Sent: Tuesday, December 20, 2011 5:56 PM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Top 25 websites for gamers who are blind
Elanor,
Unlike Dark, I don't understand why you would exclude online
games in
this day and age. It may have made sense a decade ago, but the
fact
of the matter is that 'standalone' games are rapidly becoming
the
minority. Even now, I wouldn't be surprised if you were leaving
half
of the available games off the table with the current listing
requirements.
The closest analogy I can come up with is that it's like making
a list
of the all time greatest songs and leaving out anything that
uses a
drum machine.
Given that the current 'top 25' list is set up more as 'top 25
plus a
bunch of extra lists for overflow material', perhaps it would be
better for the blind community to do some kind of multiple list
or
hierarchical setup: the years best individual games,
downloadable game
sites, online games, game developers, that sort of thing. Right
now,
the currently list is so widely variable in quality and landing
page
type that its usefulness is diminished.
Dennis Towne
Alter Aeon MUD
http://www.alteraeon.com
On Tue, Dec 20, 2011 at 6:35 AM, dark <d...@xgam.org> wrote:
Hi eleanor.
while I understand not reviewing sites for uniquely online games
such as
muds, I'm afraid I'm a litle confused why you would list a game
like
Sound
rts or the topspeed series from playinginthedark, who's primary
interest is
it's online play, without considdering the online audio games
available such
as Blind adrenalin, Quentin C playroom and Rs client.
Pluss, as far as Blind adrenaline goes there is the Rail racer
game,
which
is also playable offline.
while I appreciate the methodology, perhaps a more complete
explanation of
what does or does not count as "online" in this context would be
a good
thing, ---- and also as I said, might influence the final list.
Beware the grue!
Dark.
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