I think that formation is important. As for the rest, I think it has a place in some games, but that Time of Conflict is, I think, not the game. Many games replicate the difficulty of supply by forcing units to return to base. That is one option.
Signed: Dakotah Rickard On 6/20/12, dark <[email protected]> wrote: > Hi Milo. > > That is a good point, though I confess this isn't someone I've heard of in > military terms. > > however I'm not sure about the replication of the mechanic as a simple > cumulative chance, sinse it's equally possible for an army unit to be sat > around with nobody to fight and no new orders for so long that their drill > becomes stale and they become less! effective, ven if they aren't foraging > on the land. Plus, from a game balance point of view if a unit can become > better and better by doing nothing, this isn't much insentive to the player > > to use that unit. > > I'd probably suggest that rest be replicated as it in in a mud, where for a > > certain amount of actions the unit will be fine, however after a given point > > of moving, fighting, deploying or other actions the effectiveness of the > unit decreases until it spends a turn doing nothing, ie, the prolonged > forced activity has tired out the soldiers. > > Beware the grue! > > Dark. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Milos Przic" <[email protected]> > To: "Gamers Discussion list" <[email protected]> > Sent: Wednesday, June 20, 2012 8:48 PM > Subject: Re: [Audyssey] Realism in military stratogy games > > >> Hi Dark, >> Good point. I would add one more thing to make things ever more realistic. >> >> In the military academies all over the World a strategy of vojvojda >> Zivojin Misic is being studied. The duke (vojvoda) was the leader of the >> first army during the World War I, and the army faught the austro >> hungarians at the river of Kolubara near valjevo, Serbia. Without going >> into many details, he simply let the soldiers to rest enough, and the >> trupes of the Austro Hungarians were defeeted. So,in the terms of gaming, >> >> and let's take TOC as an example again, the more soldiers march, the less >> >> possible is for them to win in a turn of the battle. The more turns they >> rest, the bigger possibility to win a turn... >> Your thaughts? >> Milos Przic >> msn: [email protected] >> skype: Milosh-hs >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "dark" <[email protected]> >> To: <[email protected]> >> Sent: Wednesday, June 20, 2012 11:32 AM >> Subject: [Audyssey] Realism in military stratogy games >> >> >>> Hi. >>> >>> At the moment I've just started reading the sharpe series of books by >>> Bernard cornwell, a set of books about a British rifleman set before and >>> >>> during the early 1800's, who starts off as a private and rises to become >>> >>> an officer, fighting first in the battles in India then in the napoleonic >>> >>> wars in flanders, spain and france, (I've read some of these before and >>> seen the tv series with sean been, but I'd not read the ones set early in >>> >>> Sharpe's life in India). >>> >>> Cornwell is very historically accurate with the events, tactics and >>> technology of the time, and indeed even when he takes poetic license he >>> explains exactly what license he has taken in historical notes, so as >>> well as being pretty good stories in their own right, the sharpe books >>> give a real idea of how battles were fought at that time in history, >>> (cornwell has also written similar books set in other historical periods, >>> >>> but the sharpe series are his most famous). >>> >>> The one thing however that really strikes me reading these books from a >>> gaming perspective, is just how inadequate so many games are in >>> portraying the situation, supplies, and tactics required by a miliary >>> force. >>> >>> Even in time of conflict for instance, you don't have even an >>> approximation of the sort of situations and decisions that make up a >>> ilitary campaigne. >>> >>> To illustrate in the book I'm reading now, Sharpe's Triump >>> (chronologicaly second in the series), two, a battle is taking place >>> betwene a very large army formed of a confederation of the Mahrata indian >>> >>> princes, and two much smaller forces under the joint command of Sir >>> arthur wellsley, later known as the duke of wellington. >>> >>> The indian force is ten times the size of the british force, and has a >>> far greater load of artiliary behind them. Thus, in any purely numeric >>> situation such as that in Toc, they should pretty much automatically >>> win. >>> >>> however, there are several factors working against them. >>> >>> The bulk of the indian force are not carrying their own supplies, meaning >>> >>> that they are foraging the countryside for provisions, (including taking >>> >>> it from the local population), thus meaning that sinse resources in any >>> given area are limited when it comes to supporting such a huge >>> encampment, they are on a severe time limit. >>> >>> The british forces however carry their own food supplies with them. While >>> >>> this does give them advantages in terms of maneuverability and time, it >>> also dictates their movements quite severely, sinse the food and other >>> supplies are carried by bullock carts, which require roads on which to >>> move, and also which obviously can't move too fast. >>> >>> Then, there is the matter of formation. One of the advantages the british >>> >>> army at that time had against a larger force was that british army fought >>> >>> in just two ranks. The front rank would fire, then kneel and reload their >>> >>> weapons while the rank behind them fired. This two rank formation also >>> let them more easily surround a larger enemy force. The distadvantage >>> however, is that this formation was useless at stopping cavalry, sinse >>> horses were fast enough to close quickly, break through the ranks and do >>> >>> huge amounts of damage, thus forcing the british soldiers to break their >>> >>> formation and form defensive squares whenever they came upon cavalry >>> units (and didn't have any of their own cavalry to protect against >>> them). >>> >>> On the other hand, the large columns the french fought in, while less >>> affective in terms of volume of fire or ability to encircle an opponent, >>> >>> were far more defensible against cavalry attacks. >>> >>> However, both of these elements, supply lines and formations are things I >>> >>> think could be quite easily added to a military stratogy game such as >>> time of conflict, by basically setting the properties of each unit. >>> >>> For instance, changing the formation of a unit could alter it's attack or >>> >>> defense value against both other types of unit and other formations, ---- >>> >>> which would also make (as in reality), information about the enemy far >>> more necessary. Obviously formation could be changed reactively, but not >>> >>> during actual battle without a severe loss of time and attack. >>> >>> Then, supplies! in time of conflict supplies weren't an issue, and in >>> sound rts supplies were pretty static, simply build farms and farm them, >>> >>> with no suggestion of how the food got from those farms to your troops. >>> >>> of course, castaways had a much more detailed supply chain, but castaways >>> >>> was a far more individualized game with a different, none military >>> setting. >>> >>> once again, supplies could be dictated upon unit creation or orders. For >>> >>> instance, having a property such that the more food a unit took them, the >>> >>> longer they could spend out on the map before returning to a staging >>> point, however, the disadvantage being that the more it carried, the >>> slower it's speed. Alternatively, units could be set to forage, but at a >>> >>> cost of their attack (hungry soldiers don't fight as well, and foraging >>> is far less efficient at feeding troops than carrying their own rations), >>> >>> and also the fact that once one area of the map was foraged, it couldn't >>> >>> be foraged again for several turns. >>> >>> this would make supply lines, depots and staging areas far more of a >>> concern, and mean that units such as cart trains would also have a place >>> >>> in the game as well. >>> >>> What are people's thoughts? >>> >>> >>> Beware the Grue! >>> >>> Dark. >>> --- >>> Gamers mailing list __ [email protected] >>> If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to >>> [email protected]. >>> You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at >>> http://mail.audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. >>> All messages are archived and can be searched and read at >>> http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]. >>> If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the >>> list, >>> please send E-mail to [email protected]. >>> >>> >>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >>> signature database 7236 (20120620) __________ >>> >>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >>> >>> http://www.eset.com >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus >> signature database 7236 (20120620) __________ >> >> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >> >> http://www.eset.com >> >> >> >> >> --- >> Gamers mailing list __ [email protected] >> If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to >> [email protected]. >> You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at >> http://mail.audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. >> All messages are archived and can be searched and read at >> http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]. >> If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the >> list, >> please send E-mail to [email protected]. > > > --- > Gamers mailing list __ [email protected] > If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to > [email protected]. > You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at > http://mail.audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. > All messages are archived and can be searched and read at > http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]. > If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, > please send E-mail to [email protected]. > --- Gamers mailing list __ [email protected] If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to [email protected]. 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