Re: [Gecko] mealworms

[Owdicat<*><*><*>]

I mean NO offense to anyone whatsoever, I was stating what I had been told by countless people, professionals & also fellow keepers.  This whole "fighting" thing or whatever you would call it is not my thing, I would like to keep the peace & for everyone to see the others point of view. I love this list, I didn't mean to cause anything, I was giving advice that people have given to me. BTW THIS IS NOT AN ATTACK, its in defense of myself, & maybe can offer some understanding into what & why I do it. The CAPPED words are not yelling, just emphasis on the word.   I never said that I had a CASE of a mealworm eating one of my Animals <S> I've been & still am being careful, because these animals mean more to me then a science experiment or a hobby. I've read as many pieces of material on these animals I could, I still read just about every night about them, to make sure that I'm doing everything right. I've searched the web, bought books & "Reptiles" and "Vivarium" (Among others) magazine since I can remember, I've really done my homework, but I guess it's not enough. Because I believe that quality care & fussing over them is worth it, I'm made to look  AND FEEL like a fool, because I LOVE my animals & want what is best for THEM, I am made to feel & and look like a fool among my peers. & I truly resent that. You could have pointed out that YOU did not feel that was good advice but that it may be true, that someone else thought it so & I had a right to be careful with the lives of my animals, & you could have given me credit  FOR the worrying & Fussing I do & tried in a nice way to set me straight to what you thought was right. But, you DID NOT, you attacked me, & what I have been told BY OTHER PEOPLE, I didn't just make this stuff up, people told me this, I have several friends in the petstore business (I know, how awful of me to even talk to those people, but some of them really do care, & even some of them have been to college, studying Herps.) that have told me what I told you all. I wasn't being overbearing, mean or hateful when I gave that advice, I was trying to help, because this is how I've kept my Herps. since I was a kid. But you guys just jumped down my throat without giving me a chance; and WERE, mean, overbearing & very hateful in my eyes & in the eyes of the people that have read this. I will not say I haven't lost a animal in my life, but can ANY of you? I will not say I haven't had a unhealthy animal, because I have, but I corrected the illness, & as a matter of fact, I have bought animals that I thought were not taken care of  right, I have a White's Tree Frog right now that is recovering from a illness that was caused by the previous owner, he brought him back to the pet shop, i don't know if he knew this & got rid of it or what, but I am treating it, & he is getting better. I also got one that had a cut toe that was rather nasty looking, that could have been fatal, but I KNEW enough to treat it, I know how to take care of my animals, especially when it matters the most. I lost ONE Leo. Gecko because of shipping complications, I took her to the vet, I force fed her everyday, like the vet told me to, I put everything I could into that gecko, not because, she was going to be a "Breeder" or a "prize" but because I cared for her, she was a pet & she needed me to help her live, at least for then, & I felt I let her down, & I cried for days over it when I lost her, that is why I worry so much about them.   I love to interact with Herps, what can I say. I don't do it all the time, but it is nice to hand feed them & make sure that they are ok, that they are eating ok, not have any problems swallowing or that the other animal(s) in the tank is not pigging out & not leaving any for the other,  I make sure that they all get what they need. I feed them separately, & I never said I hand fed crix all the time, I hand feed with Mealworms as treats, (if, you guys had given me a chance to explain how I feed & why I do it that way, maybe you would've understood) I will admit, I'm a worry wort, but I'd like to be known for my worrying, because if, something is wrong, I will know sooner if I interact with them then if I didn't. If you would like I could take some pics of the next hunting session & send them to you :) I find it very, VERY insulting that you, without seeing my animals would make the assumption that they are unhealthy, or have ever been. Besides, no offense but I put merit in what my vet says, as to see if my herps are healthy or not<S> How would you like for me to say that because you feed one way that your animals are not healthy? I would never do that, because I've not seen your animals. & let's all remember the tale from the Bible, where there was a woman about to be stoned for sinning, & Our Lord Jesus said, "let you that have not sinned cast the first stone". And a golden rule I live by is this, "Treat others as you would like to be treated" or for a more new age version, "What goes around, comes around, it's called Karma" Or yet another, "Pick the needles out of your own eye before you go picking in someone else's" I have recent pictures of my herps, if you would like, I can send some to the list. I just have to find them first LOL! I have far too many, alot of baby pics let me tell ya! Sheesh LOL! I assure you, they are all doing great, everyone has wonderful color, eating well & gets the care that all God's creatures deserve from man. I try not to feed in the tank they reside in, because of the sand(or in the case of my Frogs, gravel or any other substrate) hazard. & if I do, as I said before, I watch them eat, & any "leftovers" I take out & save for the next night. And for the record, I'm not stupid, I don't give my small Green Tree Frog(2 inches SVL BTW) a huge adult cricket, or a mealworm that I think is over sized, nothing longer then the width of the animals head... that's what i read & live by, but I guess I should double check that. While I'm speaking of my frogs, I should note that my Tomato Frogs don't chew, I watch them, & they are so aggressive towards their prey while they hunt that they swallow as soon as it gets in their mouthes, if I had a dig. camera I would record them doing so, so you guys could see. Just wanted to note that, since this is a Gecko list, and I presume most if not all of you have nothing but reptiles, & no amphibians I just wanted you guys to know what I do about how my frogs eat:) God Bless you & your Herps. & may you have the most wonderful of New Years!! Ash *whistling while skipping off to feed the Chelonian, Fossorial & Nocturnal "Kids", then to settle in for a long winters nap, til feeding time comes again that is LOL!* & Windcreek Farms.                                                                                                                                                                                                 ----- Original Message ----- From: Julie Bergman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Saturday, December 30, 2000 9:51 PM Subject: Re: [Gecko] mealworms > > I read a book from what I feel is a very reputable Herp. keeper; I'll quote > > from his Gecko > > book "Geckos" by Jerry G. And Maleta M. Walls- page 22."There are repeated > > stories of large mealworms literally eating through the gut of a small > > lizard and exiting alive through the belly. Large mealworms should be killed > > by crushing the head, dipping them in hot water, or slitting then open...." > > > This is a very bad piece of advice, I am sorry to see it in print. Hilde > or someone else (excuse me if I have this wrong) made the much more > appropriate suggestion of matching size of food item to the gecko/herp. > There is never any need to crush food except in the case of sick herp. > > > > Several people (pet shop owners, Herptology students ect.) say to crush the > > heads of meal worms & crix for safety sake. > > > > These folks are WAY off. No experienced herp keeper worth their salt > would ever make that suggestion! Thanks to them this "old wives tale" > still exists. > > Another qualification is health of the herp. An unhealthy herp, which > sounds like Owdicat had several cases, cannot hunt food or digest > properly, so food tends to eat them. If you sat still long enough and > enough mealworms or crickets were around, they would certainly dine on > you also! > > Lastly, one should not feed a gecko more than it can deal with in about > an hour. There should not be tons of food running around loose in the > terrarium. If there is on a regular basis, this could stress the gecko > and cause its health to fail and ultimately, ugh, be eaten by all that > excess food that should not have been in the terrarium in the first > place. > > Julie Bergman > http://www.geckoranch.com > GGA lifetime member >