John, You are so my kinda politician! I'll sign up!
Ed Richards PS: Happy Independance Day to the USA and all of you on the list! At 03:01 PM 7/4/2002 -0700, you wrote: >Ed, > >You can sign up at: > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ccccpolitics/ > >I started it because heated discussion, mostly about >politics, was restricted on CCCCList. I'd like to see >reasoned arguments on it on any subject, but I'm also >willing to give people enough rope to hang themselves >in it. ;) > >John Hebert > >--- Ed <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > John, > > > > Try signing up for one of the classes. It will tell > > you IMMEDIATELY that > > you are not running IE!! > > > > Ed Richards > > > > PS: I am a member of the Clickers newbies group, but > > not the other group. > > Where is it? Looks like it could make for some > > interesting reading! > > > > > > > > At 01:04 AM 7/4/2002 -0500, you wrote: > > >As in Cajun Clickers Computer Club > > @yahoogroups.com? whoooboy. You just > > >fed me to the wolves, dude! <:-D BTW, in response > > to another post I read > > >here, I visited clickers.org to look for an IE-only > > warning. Didn't see > > >it. Used Mozilla 1.0. Am I missing something? > > > > > >-- > > >-j > > > > > >John Beamon > > > > > >On Wed, 3 Jul 2002, John Hebert wrote: > > > > > > > Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 14:50:55 -0700 (PDT) > > > > From: John Hebert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > Reply-To: [email protected] > > > > To: [email protected] > > > > Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > Subject: RE: [brlug-general] IE un-Security > > > > > > > > Wow. Too good to keep here in [email protected], > > so I > > > > forwarding this to [EMAIL PROTECTED], > > where > > > > politically incorrect rant is encouraged. > > > > > > > > John Hebert > > > > > > > > --- john beamon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > I want to take this one step farther. There > > is a > > > > > sales mentality that > > > > > computers CAN be bought, plugged in, and on > > the web > > > > > in 10 minutes. > > > > > Therefore, they SHOULD be bought, plugged in, > > and on > > > > > the web in 10 > > > > > minutes. I find this inherently incorrect and > > > > > bordering on arrogant. > > > > > > > > > > We do not require computer users to know two > > cents > > > > > worth about their > > > > > machines or their safe use. We require > > waiting > > > > > periods, licensing, > > > > > training, and legal registration for the > > purchase or > > > > > even use of guns, > > > > > cars, motorcycles, heavy equipment, arc > > welders, > > > > > etc, but nothing for > > > > > computers. Even now, computers and "security > > tools" > > > > > like GPG and basic > > > > > encryption are being criminalized as tools of > > > > > terrorists, when the truth > > > > > is closer to "terrorists are safer, more > > > > > knowledgeable users of basic > > > > > computer functions than most Windows users". > > > > > Frankly, I applaud their > > > > > steps taken toward privacy and discretion and > > smart > > > > > computer use; when was > > > > > the last time the US government cracked a > > terrorist > > > > > network or fed it a > > > > > virus in a Word document? MS commoditized and > > > > > simplified the entry-level > > > > > OS and released it into the wild. It is > > generally > > > > > speaking insecure, > > > > > buggy, and exploitable. Common users are > > generally > > > > > naive about its > > > > > workings and its safe and controlled use in > > public > > > > > (networked). By > > > > > engineering remote control software into XP, > > MS has > > > > > shown that they > > > > > continue to prefer and promote a naive user > > base and > > > > > centralized boo-boo > > > > > management. > > > > > > > > > > I disagree strenuously, on grounds economic, > > social, > > > > > political, and > > > > > functional. I believe that users with > > increased > > > > > clue would trade messages > > > > > and data in portable formats, not shiny ones, > > so > > > > > that they can be reached > > > > > from any commoditized machine in any library, > > home, > > > > > or educational > > > > > institution. Anything from an industrial dumb > > > > > terminal to a library PC to > > > > > a college Mac should be able to read email and > > > > > browse the web with at > > > > > least some functionality. I believe that more > > > > > clueful users would rather > > > > > keep their private info private than let MS > > into > > > > > their machine or let > > > > > their cd player (Media Player) report their > > > > > listening habits back to a > > > > > vendor. I believe that users would feel safer > > about > > > > > themselves and the > > > > > world at large if they had the basic > > intellectual > > > > > tools to avoid every > > > > > virus-infected email attachment that gets sent > > them. > > > > > Understand, please, > > > > > that the vast, VAST majority of viral traffic > > is > > > > > instigated by curiousity, > > > > > not by brute force. More people open unkown > > email > > > > > attachments, after the > > > > > years of Melissa and Nimda and HappyWorm, than > > are > > > > > infected by > > > > > sophisticated autoexecuting binaries in their > > > > > unopened mail spools. Those > > > > > sophisticated worms ARE a problem, but they > > are the > > > > > Ebola virus in a world > > > > > where millions die for not washing their hands > > > > > before they eat. > > > > > > > > > > The native faculty of Windows to execute any > > virus > > > > > that comes down the > > > > > pike from what SHOULD -- by all measures > > functional > > > > > and reasonable -- be a > > > > > text-only environment is a problem. An > > out-of-box > > > > > problem. It was > > > > > mentioned earlier that a new user on an > > out-of-box > > > > > machine is not > > > > > necessarily "insecure", and I disagree to the > > very > > > > > last iota. XP comes > > > > > preinstalled with the ability to turn on your > > PC's > > > > > mic, call home to > > > > > Microsoft, and allow internet access to your > > > > > filesystem, all without your > > > > > permission or even knowledge. Don't leave > > home WITH > > > > > it. I am running one > > > > > XP box right now, months after it has been > > > > > proctologized and patched into > > > > > delirium. I'm still behind a firewall, and I > > still > > > > > read all my mail in > > > > > either PINE or Mozilla, in plain text, > > > > > thank-you-very-much. > > > > > > > > > > I'm not an OS bigot; I've got four copies of > > Windows > > > > > installed in my > > > > > house, three of them dual-booted with Linux. > > I am, > > > > > however, placing the > > > > > blame for this "security" problem where it > > belongs, > > > > > the official practice > > > > > of turning loose self-aware "appliances" that > > run > > > > > programs out of text > > > > > documents and expose raw network sockets to > > every > > > > > process on the box. > > > > > Users who want mail and web should get a > > non-root > > >=== message truncated === > > >__________________________________________________ >Do You Yahoo!? >Sign up for SBC Yahoo! Dial - First Month Free >http://sbc.yahoo.com > >_______________________________________________ >General mailing list >[email protected] >http://brlug.net/mailman/listinfo/general_brlug.net
