FWIW I rejected an incubator proposal before they submitted it formally in
the past weeks with the suggestion to run an open-source community first as
Sheng & Ming suggested above.
This is never permanent. And often, a healthy project takes a few months to
determine whether entering the incubator is a good idea. All the projects I
mentored (Kvrocks, StreamPark, and OpenDAL) have been running a community
for one to two years outside the incubator.
Be aware that it's not a hard requirement, but the understanding of
"entering the incubator" is the concern.
> There is no magic in the Apache incubator. Don't expect the incubator
will make your project international and successful
I read this sentence as a reply to the following understanding:
>> The user interface currently only has Chinese, and the
internationalization of the page requires a longer time to iterate, but we
will complete the transformation of this function in the early stage of
incubation;
>> We have checked in advance, and we hope to do the replacement and
upgrade during the future incubation period.
>>> Our project is open and is willing to cooperate with the Apache
Incubator community, mentors, and other relevant parties to resolve
potential license issues.
The mission of Incubator is[1]:
> It helps those incoming projects (called "podlings") adopt the Apache
style of governance and operation and guides them to the ASF services
available to our projects so they can become top-level ASF projects
("TLPs").
... and according to the answer of "Does our project fit the Apache
Incubator?"[2]:
> To give our "podlings" (incubating projects) the best chances of success,
we usually ask them to enter the Incubator with at least the start of a
community built around an existing codebase.
So the Incubator doesn't help in "create" the community, but help in shape
the community following the Apache style of governance and operation.
Best,
tison.
[1] https://incubator.apache.org/
[2]
https://incubator.apache.org/cookbook/#does_our_project_fit_the_apache_incubator
Ming Wen <wenm...@apache.org> 于2023年9月6日周三 14:55写道：
> After reading these responses, I feel that this project is not ready to
> enter the Apache Incubator, especially considering that you have received
> support from 6 mentors and communicated with them.
> There is no magic in the Apache incubator. Don't expect the incubator will
> make your project international and successful. For example, I noticed the
> issues were all in Chinese, and no one reviewed PRs before merged.
>
> Thanks,
> Ming Wen, Apache APISIX PMC Chair
> Twitter: _WenMing
>
>
> Zhiyong Zhang <goodj...@apache.org> 于2023年9月5日周二 22:33写道：
>
> >
> >
> > On 2023/09/05 05:56:51 Sheng Wu wrote:
> > > Several important things
> >
> > The entire project https://github.com/XiaoMi/mone has passed the
> internal
> > audit of Xiaomi, and the owners and leaders of the entire project are
> > consistent with the initiators of the ozhera project. The main donation
> to
> > ASF this time is ozhera-all, and other modules follow the Apache
> protocol,
> > which will not cause protocol or ownership ambiguity.
> > > 1. You are mentioning the donation is about
> > > `https://github.com/XiaoMi/mone/tree/master/ozhera-all`
> <https://github.com/XiaoMi/mone/tree/master/ozhera-all>
> > <https://github.com/XiaoMi/mone/tree/master/ozhera-all>, It is a part
> > > of the repository, so will others stay out of the ASF? If so, have the
> > > project been going through Xiaomi's internal audit about the sharing
> > > codes between this part of the whole project? Who owns that?
> >
> > We hope to complete the internationalization transformation with the help
> > of ASF; we are preparing the English documents, and a version will be
> > completed by tomorrow;
> > > 2. I can't see any English document for the project. Is the community
> > > for a global foundation incubating journey?
> >
> > The user interface currently only has Chinese, and the
> > internationalization of the page requires a longer time to iterate, but
> we
> > will complete the transformation of this function in the early stage of
> > incubation;
> > > 3. More importantly, all screenshots and UIs are only in Chinese as
> well?
> >
> > a.We have received full support from Xiaomi's legal affairs and are able
> > to submit the SGA;
> > b.The project has gradually recruited partners outside of Xiaomi, and the
> > initial committers from Xiaomi are also actively participating in the
> > construction of other open source communities. These are a group of
> > partners who are passionate about open source. I believe that this group
> of
> > partners can continue the project in the long term.
> > > 4. Have Xiaomi Inc. agreed on this? Will they submit a SGA? Are the
> > > initial committers still working on Xiaomi and going to continue work
> > > this project? Will Xiaomi permit their CCLAs?
> >
> > We have checked in advance, and we hope to do the replacement and upgrade
> > during the future incubation period.
> > > 5. I can see several incompatible licenses of dependencies existing,
> > > including GPLs. Do you have plans to remove or replace them? Have you
> > > worked with your mentors to go through licenses of dependencies check?
> >
> > There is a relatively clear division of labor among the mentors, and the
> > mentors will regularly assign us corresponding tasks. Through efficient
> > project collaboration, we ensure the activity of the community;
> > At the same time, we can gain more experience and guidance from multiple
> > mentors, which will further promote the positive cycle development of the
> > community.
> > > 6. Why a 10 people PPMC initial team has a mentor team of 6 people?
> > > Typically, I don't think this is a good practice. Instead, mentors are
> > > most likely counting on others and will become inactive.
> >
> > I hope that ozhera can play its value in the observability of
> cloud-native
> > applications. Many components in ozhera (Opentelemetry, Grafana,
> > Prometheus, MQ, etc.) come from the open source community. We hope to
> feed
> > back our experience in the field of application observation to the
> > community through this platform. The UI design will actively embrace open
> > source like the backend, but we hope to implement mature solutions from
> the
> > community for chart display, currently it is Grafana.
> > > 7. How would you process the branding? Including you are sharing UI
> > > design. I have concerns this would be another issues with the main
> > > project.
> >
> > a. We have chosen MySQL and Elasticsearch as the project's storage
> > solutions based on their excellent performance in their respective
> fields.
> > The versions we have chosen strictly comply with the GPL and Apache2.0
> > agreements.
> > b. While Elasticsearch has changed from Apache 2.0 to the Server Side
> > Public License (SSPL), although SSPL is no longer an OSI-approved open
> > source license, it still allows free use, modification, and distribution,
> > but imposes some restrictions on commercial use.
> > c. We are also working on storage design. In the future, we will abstract
> > a complete storage layer interface to decouple the code logic from the
> > specific storage implementation. This facilitates integrating more
> > alternative storage solutions. Our project is open and is willing to
> > cooperate with the Apache Incubator community, mentors, and other
> relevant
> > parties to resolve potential license issues.
> > > 8. You are using MySQL and ElasticSearch as storage. The one is on GPL
> > > and the other is not longer OSI-approved license anymore. What is your
> > > plan on that?
> >
> > Firstly, SkyWalking is an excellent open source APM, with comprehensive
> > capabilities in tracing, real-time topology, and multi-language
> adaptation.
> > The starting point for creating OzHera is to build an enterprise-level
> > observability platform for the cloud-native era that truly solves the
> > problem of discovering business issues within 1 minute and locating them
> > within 5 minutes.
> > Its core features include:
> > a. Embracing Cloud-native
> > It adheres to the Opentracing standard and integrates several renowned
> > open-source products including Opentelemetry, Grafana, Prometheus, and
> ES.
> > Hera also deeply adapts to K8S and provides one-click deployment
> capability
> > based on K8S.
> > b. Accuracy: Availability metrics
> > Too many alerts essentially equate to ineffective alerts, making the
> > accuracy of alerts particularly important. No one understands the
> > correctness of requests better than their own business error codes. We
> > incorporate the ability to recognize business error codes into the
> business
> > availability metrics, allowing business alerts to focus on just this one
> > indicator. At the same time, we are also expanding SLA metrics to view
> the
> > availability of server services from the client's perspective.
> > c. Excellent Linkage: Metrics-Tracing-Logging linkage
> > Based on the traceId, we establish a closed-loop linkage of
> > alarm->indicator->link->log, significantly improving user efficiency in
> > pinpointing issues.
> > d. Economical: <0.1% storage cost, satisfying 99.9% of tracing demands
> > We judge the importance of traces (exceptional span, single span calls
> > exceeding 1s, error log output, business exception error codes, etc.).
> Any
> > trace identified as important is fully retained, while the remaining
> normal
> > traces are sampled to ensure efficiency while considering economic costs.
> > e. Enterprise-level Observable Product
> > Complete tenant permissions and application management mechanisms make it
> > easy for users to quickly deploy and integrate their own accounts, CI/CD
> > systems, etc., within the enterprise. It can also quickly connect to
> > enterprise office software to achieve alert delivery;
> > Within Xiaomi, it handles over 100T of data daily in a smooth and
> > efficient manner;
> > The core link is well decoupled to facilitate rapid scaling at each
> stage.
> > For large volumes of tracing, we have implemented head and tail sampling
> to
> > ensure the platform's cost-effectiveness.
> > > 9 What are the differences between you and SkyWalking? What is this
> > > new project bringing new to the users? Notice, this is a not a
> > > rejection for a similar project, but, if they are nearly same, you
> > > will face competitions in the same foundation but already have larger
> > > community.
> > >
> > > Sheng Wu 吴晟
> > > Twitter, wusheng1108
> > >
> > > Yu Xiao <xia...@apache.org> 于2023年9月5日周二 11:12写道：
> > > >
> > > > Dear incubator community,
> > > >
> > > > I would like to propose OzHera[1] as a new apache incubator project,
> > you
> > > > can find the proposal[2] of OzHera for more detail.
> > > >
> > > > OzHera is an application performance observation platform that
> centers
> > > > around applications,
> > > > integrating metric monitoring, link tracing, logs, alerts, and other
> > > > capabilities.
> > > > The Hera platform has the following core features:
> > > >
> > > > ** Embrace Cloud Native
> > > > Complies with the Opentracing standard, integrating multiple star
> > > > open-source products such as OpenTelemetry,
> > > > Grafana, Prometheus, ES, CAdvisor, etc. At the same time, Hera deeply
> > > > adapts to K8S,
> > > > providing one-click deployment on K8S through operator.
> > > >
> > > > ** Precise: Availability Metrics
> > > > We have defined corresponding availability metrics for common RPC
> > > > (Dubbo, HTTP, etc.) requests.
> > > > These request-scope metrics are automatically extracted from tracing
> > > > by Hera, and during extraction,
> > > > we enhance the ability to recognize business error codes.
> > > > A single metric can accurately express the exceptions encapsulated by
> > > > RPC and business processing.
> > > >
> > > > ** Quick: Metrics-Tracing-Logging Linkage
> > > > Based on traceId, it links the alarm -> metrics -> link -> log closed
> > loop.
> > > > From the moment the alarm card touches the user, the user can quickly
> > > > view the link and log situation related to this alarm,
> > > > greatly improving the efficiency of problem locating.
> > > >
> > > > ** Economical
> > > > Less than 0.1% storage cost, satisfying 99.9% of tracing demands
> > > > OzHera achieves the recognition of abnormal calls (error span,
> > > > abnormal business error codes,
> > > > error logs, single span time exceeding 1 second, etc.) and ensures
> the
> > > > storage of data for the entire call link of abnormal traces.
> > > > For normal traces, we adopt a default random sampling strategy of one
> > > > in ten thousand.
> > > >
> > > > ** Enterprise-level Observable Products
> > > > Complete account, permission, application management mechanisms,
> > > > allowing users to quickly implement within the enterprise and connect
> > > > to the enterprise’s own account, application deployment system, etc.
> > > > It can also quickly dock with enterprise office software to achieve
> > > > alarm touch. Core links are well decoupled for rapid scaling,
> > > > and for large volumes of tracing, we have implemented tail sampling
> > strategies,
> > > > able to support high qps, real-time observable demands of high
> > > > timeliness systems.
> > > >
> > > > [1] https://github.com/XiaoMi/mone/tree/master/ozhera-all
> > > > [2]
> > https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/INCUBATOR/OzHeraProposal
> > > >
> > > > Best,
> > > > Yu Xiao
> > > >
> > > > ASF Member
> > > > Apache ShenYu V.P.
> > > > Apache Incubator PMC
> > > >
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> > > >
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> > >
> > >
> >
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> >
> >
>
