On Tue, 2002-02-05 at 03:14, Peter Donald wrote: > On Tue, 5 Feb 2002 11:38, Andrew C. Oliver wrote: > > > Are you upset at the way Java is being handled by SUN? > > > > > > Do you feel lied to about the fact that SUN is still keeping Java > > > proprietary even after they promised us for *years* that it would be > > > standardized? > > > > > > Are you looking towards .NET/C# as an alternative but still optimistic > > > about Java? > > > > Heck no. .NET/c# why would I want to use an even more proprietary thing > > to get back at SUN? Heck no. > > You sure it is more proprietary? I believe our PMC head actually sits as head > on one of the standardization efforts for C#s core libraries. With the recent > change to BSDL/MIT licensing with one of the opensource runtimes things are > starting to look interesting. >
Can I run it on Linux? Will a WORKING non-broken version ever run on Linux. > Technically there are things about C#/CLR/etc that are far superior to Java > (much better meta-data support, no JNI pain, a nicer GUI setup, support for C > based languages, etc) and theres also things that suck (hard to optimize > bytecode, crapola linking model, etc). > True, but if past predictors continue to hold, there will never be a version that runs reliably on another platform. And windows is a very crappy platform. (I can do Solaris, UNIX, I prefer Linux but I can cope with other good OSes) > *if* there was an open, semi-stable platform then I am sure a fair chunk of > people would flock to it - especially if it is under a nice license like MIT > that both the BSD and GPL people seem to like. > BUT THERE WON'T BE! That's the kicker. If we're just talking about Java alternatives, I'm falling more in love (from a distance) with the "D" language. It needs bytecode, etc (but I think the platform should evolve in the language perhaps but separately from it) > I don't think Sun will lose on high-end or the embedded device market but > everywhere else I think is debatable ;) A lot of people I know who are java > advocates have seriously looked at swapping to C# - at least for the desktop. > Given how weak the C# runtime is now (at least compared to java) this I find > interesting. > Microsoft people will of course switch to it. People who need serious servers will need something that runs on UNIX. > If JDK1.5 comes out in time with all its very kool features I think Java > still has a fighting chance ... maybe. If the J2SE was opensourced then it > would almost win by default. However Sun is nowhere near as agile as MS - > still too much of a slow hardware company - so they will almost certainly > fall down in that area. > So far I'm unimpressed with what has been added to 1.4 in the period of time its taken. Mostly "candy" no meat. > It will be interesting to see how IBM reacts. They have some damn fine VM > people there, if they were to go the C# path and bring along all the Linux > peeps then .... who knows ;) > I've never had much luck with IBM's JDKs. I seem to be the guy who always runs into some horrible bug. -Andy > -- > Cheers, > > Pete > > "You know what a dumbshit the 'average man' on the street is? Well, by > definition, half of them are even dumber than that!" > J.R. "Bob" Dobbs > > -- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > For additional commands, e-mail: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > -- www.superlinksoftware.com www.sourceforge.net/projects/poi - port of Excel format to java http://developer.java.sun.com/developer/bugParade/bugs/4487555.html - fix java generics! The avalanche has already started. It is too late for the pebbles to vote. -Ambassador Kosh -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> For additional commands, e-mail: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
