On 5/15/07, Danny Angus <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
0/ Do we agree that the end-game is dissolution of the Jakarta PMC and
closure of the project?
Pro - Draws a line under the reorg effort which has gone on for 3 or
4 *years*.
Con - Removes the remaining tangible & historic links between former
Jakarta sub-projects.
At the ASF, we let them that do the work make the decisions. (Mainly
because we have to ... otherwise, there would be no one willing to do
the work!) We can talk about end-games until Sol goes nova, but in
the end the volunteers who do the work will make the decision.
So far, the subproject committers have been deciding to create their
own TLP. Not because the Jakarta PMC said so, but because the
subproject committers said so.
The one proactive step we could take is to set a deadline for other
TLPs to migrate or to find some other home, either as part of another
TLP, or with another project host. Or, we could just wait the
remaining subprojects out, and let nature take its course over the
next year or three.
1/ If so do we wish to preserve the Jakarta brand? (the website and
possibly general@)
Pro - As Ted H. says "We should stop thinking of "Jakarta" only as
an entity, and go back to thinking of it as to the ASF synonym for
"Java", as originally intended."
With this thought in mind around 10% of the referrals to
james.apache come from jakarta.apache.
Con - Others consider that the effort of maintaining the resources
would be unacceptable to anyone.\
The goodness of the Jakarta brand isn't the result of working on the
Jakarta brand. It's the result of fostering healthy communities that
create great software. Now, those communities have gone on to create
their own TLPs, and to create their own brands. Sure, Jakarta has name
recognition. But so does Ant and Maven and Struts and Tapestry and
Velocity.
Essentially, Jakarta was the first incubator. Now we have a top-level
Incubator, and most of our subprojects have gone on to become TLP too.
I think Java at Apache has succeeded beyond anyone's wildest dreams.
Today, the communities we fostered don't need the crutch of an
uber-project. They can stand alone, and for that we should be happy!
But not to worry. Whenever we foster healthy communities that create
great software, we will create another great brand. It's what we do.
:)
2/ If we believe that the brand should be preserved should the commons
TLP take ownership of the brand (if/when Jakarta PMC is dissolved)
Pro - Commons is an active community which continues to fulfil the
jakarta==java remit.
Con - Commons is not necessarily interested in the brand or
maintenance of its resources. (would people from other projects step
up)
At the ASF, great brands are created by healthy communities that
create great software. I would say that the Commons certainly fits
that bill. An excellent way to preserve the Jakarta name would be to
lend it to the Jakarta Commons TLP. After all, the Commons had a lot
to do with creating the Jakarta brand as it exists today.
3/ If we believe that a commons TLP should not own the brand are any
of the alternative options acceptable?
- Retain the Jakarta PMC solely to maintain the brand
- Move ownership of the brand to the prc (should they agree to have it)
- Move ownership of the brand to projects.apache maintainers
An Apache Jakarta Commons does not obviate a Jakarta federation or a
Jakarta portal. If anything, reuse of the name increases its value. We
can have our cake and eat it too!
x/ Should we consult more widely the Members and/or the Board?
At the ASF level, when we talk about protecting a brand, we usually
mean "give credit where credit is due". Being a meritocracy, we don't
want other people diluting our brand by claiming our work as theirs,
or their work as ours. So long as the Jakarta brand is not being
poached by a third-party, I doubt that anyone else would care. From an
ASF perspective, the only things of value are those things that
attract qualified volunteers. From a marketing perspective, a "brand"
may attract downloads, but I don't know if it attracts volunteers.
-Ted.
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