I am curious to see how the Sta.li guys will deal with that issue actually. At least from their "outline" it seems like they are trying to purge their system as much as possible from GNU. Personally I have no strong feelings either way (about GNU), but I find it VERY interesting with projects trying to do something entirely different and innovative (hence me lurking around here asking stupid questions and coming up with impractical ideas).
Just another reflection on the "APE" chroot/bind idea (if possible). Another cool thing it would enable (if it is at all possible to make a base system that runs (relatively) purely on Plan9/Glendix and Plan9port binaries) would be the freedom to re-define the file system hierarchy for the base system to look like that on Plan9 (users in /usr rather than /home etc...), whereas it from within the "APE" environment would look like a standard file system hierarchy (since things would be mounted that way in the chroot/other chroot-like solution). Thanks for coming up with healthy critisism. 2010/6/2 Jorden M <[email protected]> > Not true. Since the Glendix kernel is just Linux with some patches, at > least the bare bones of the usual Linux system will be there to get > things to boot (and get networking, graphics, etc. working). Even if > you restrict yourself to what runs immediately from init up to a login > screen, you're going to have a lot of programs that will need to have > a special environment made for them in the event of /bin being filled > with Plan 9 programs. > > Trying to figure out which programs depend on GNU features in binutils > programs so that they could be kept outside the special environment is > more work than it's worth. > > Having separate namespaces for all plan 9 and Linux programs would > work and probably perform ok, but the barrier created by the > namespaces may make things very inconvenient. Note that the simple > solution of having separate $PATHs will not work, since many programs > will call binutils with the full path specified. > > > On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 1:19 PM, Jens Staal <[email protected]> wrote: > > I think it is one or the other depending on a particular use case. For > the > > supposedly vast majority of users Glendix or Plan9ports will probably > just > > complement their standard GNU/Linux. For that use-case, there already are > > ports for Gentoo, for example. If Glendix would develop a "poster child" > > distro, however, I assume that it would benefit from highlighting its > unique > > characteristics rather than just being another re-spin on the GNU/Linux > > theme with some added features. > > Perhaps more a symbolic rather than technical observation - but most > > decisions made are not rational anyways... > > > > 2010/6/2 Jorden M <[email protected]> > >> > >> Bind mounts would work, also, I'm just thinking the vast amount (and > >> size) of GNU/Linux programs would make things perform worse if you had > >> to set up some special environment for every one that gets run, > >> especially considering most of the programs running at any given time > >> will be native Linux programs, not the Plan 9 ports. But perhaps not. > >> > >> On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 1:02 PM, Jens Staal <[email protected]> wrote: > >> > Only if you got programs that expect such behaviour in the base system > >> > and > >> > not exclusively run them in the "APE" (chroot?) environment with > legacy > >> > GNU > >> > binaries. > >> > > >> > 2010/6/2 Jorden Mauro <[email protected]> > >> >> > >> >> You'll break programs that expect GNU options. grep -A, for example. > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> On Jun 2, 2010, at 1:43 AM, staalmannen <[email protected]> wrote: > >> >> > >> >>> Thanks for explaining the difference. I guessed I had made a couple > of > >> >>> too simplistic assumptions. > >> >>> > >> >>> On the other hand, would it be feasible to use a mix of native Plan9 > >> >>> on Glendix and Plan9port (static)binaries in the default /bin as > >> >>> primary utilities and the regular GNU stuff in some sort of "APE" > >> >>> directory? (something not recommended by the plan9port guys, but on > >> >>> the other hand that is on a "normal" GNU/Linux distribution, whereas > >> >>> this hypothetical glendix distribution -as far as I see- more would > be > >> >>> about proof-of-concept where the plan9port portion could be > gradually > >> >>> reduced as Glendix gets more and more native Plan9 binaries to > execute > >> >>> correctly). > >> >>> > >> >>> On 31 Maj, 19:58, Jorden Mauro <[email protected]> wrote: > >> >>>> > >> >>>> Wmii does not create a draw device. It uses 9p for control, more > like > >> >>>> the FS rio or acme post. > >> >>>> > >> >>>> You could implement draw on top of X11, or even the Linux > >> >>>> framebuffer. > >> >>>> > >> >>>> On May 31, 2010, at 1:10 PM, staalmannen <[email protected]> > wrote: > >> >>>> > >> >>>> > >> >>>> > >> >>>>> I was looking around a bit and the Suckless.org Sta.li (http:// > >> >>>>> sta.li/) distribution that is in the works seems to be a pretty > good > >> >>>>> fit for a glendix-type distro, since it already tries to > Plan9-like > >> >>>>> in > >> >>>>> some ways (initiation scripts, static linking). Something built on > >> >>>>> that (perhaps with a Gobo-hide patch to make a Plan9-like file > >> >>>>> hierarchy) could be cool. > >> >>>> > >> >>>>> After reading through the different projects at Suckless, I came > >> >>>>> across that wmii actually has a 9P interface (http:// > >> >>>>> wmii.suckless.org/). Sorry for my ignorance, but would it > >> >>>>> (theoretically) be possible to "complement" the things that do not > >> >>>>> yet > >> >>>>> work natively under Linux with Glendix-patches using > >> >>>>> Plan9port+wmii+P9 > >> >>>>> mount of wmii to /dev/draw? If the lack of /dev/draw is a > temporary > >> >>>>> "blocker bug" for some Plan9 stuff to work under Glendix, perhaps > >> >>>>> that > >> >>>>> could be a temporary solution? > >> >>>> > >> >>>>> I suppose the bigger "blocker bug" is the private namespaces > stuff. > >> >>>> > >> >>>>> I have no clear idea how the different Plan9 binaries are > >> >>>>> interdependent and whether something like that would work. > >> >>>> > >> >>>>> On 19 Maj, 20:51, vh4x0r <[email protected]> wrote: > >> >>>>>> > >> >>>>>> Hi, I'm interested in contributing to the project for creation of > a > >> >>>>>> distro based on Glendix and Gentoo. I have acquainted myself with > >> >>>>>> Glendix, and also have a lot of experience with Gentoo. Can you > >> >>>>>> please > >> >>>>>> provide me with some pointers about where to start ? > >> >>>> > >> >>>>>> -- > >> >>>>>> To post to this group, send email to [email protected] > >> >>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > >> >>>>>> [email protected]<glendix%[email protected]> > >> >>>>>> For more options, visit this group > >> >>>>>> athttp://groups.google.com/group/ > >> >>>>>> glendix?hl=en > >> >>>> > >> >>>>> -- > >> >>>>> To post to this group, send email to [email protected] > >> >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > >> >>>>> [email protected]<glendix%[email protected]> > >> >>>>> For more options, visit this group > >> >>>>> athttp://groups.google.com/group/glendix?hl=en > >> >>> > >> >>> -- > >> >>> To post to this group, send email to [email protected] > >> >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > >> >>> [email protected]<glendix%[email protected]> > >> >>> For more options, visit this group at > >> >>> http://groups.google.com/group/glendix?hl=en > >> >> > >> >> -- > >> >> To post to this group, send email to [email protected] > >> >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > >> >> [email protected]<glendix%[email protected]> > >> >> For more options, visit this group at > >> >> http://groups.google.com/group/glendix?hl=en > >> > > >> > -- > >> > To post to this group, send email to [email protected] > >> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > >> > [email protected]<glendix%[email protected]> > >> > For more options, visit this group at > >> > http://groups.google.com/group/glendix?hl=en > >> > >> -- > >> To post to this group, send email to [email protected] > >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > >> [email protected]<glendix%[email protected]> > >> For more options, visit this group at > >> http://groups.google.com/group/glendix?hl=en > > > > -- > > To post to this group, send email to [email protected] > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > > [email protected]<glendix%[email protected]> > > For more options, visit this group at > > http://groups.google.com/group/glendix?hl=en > > -- > To post to this group, send email to [email protected] > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > [email protected]<glendix%[email protected]> > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/glendix?hl=en > -- To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/glendix?hl=en
