My apologies for Nicholas taking up a large portion of time and distracting everyone. He is now banned, as stated in the last email if he continued on this thread.
Chris On Tue, Oct 19, 2010 at 5:25 AM, Nicholas Sanders <[email protected]> wrote: > Chris > While I don't entirely agree with you, I have tried to understand what you > are saying from your perspective - an impossible but worthwhile aspiration > in any circumstances. It is always interesting (if often painful) to learn > how others see one, and you clearly have a long memory for my defects. > But if I try to see the world from your side, I think it only fair that you > try to see it from mine. For one thing, it is crystal clear that you have no > inkling at all as to why a mere subscriber might take offence at attacks on > the authors of the software, or that the use of certain terms might pain a > reader, whoever they are used by and at whom directed. Where I see a world I > only inhabit, you apparently see one which you want to control - no room > there for diversity of comprehension, sadly. > Whatever of that, I have at no time attempted to defend, excuse or justify > my mistake - I have freely admitted it, and apologised for it. What is > causing me the problem here is that I feel that I am being insulted and > bullied, and I don't like it. The validity of your case (which I in no way > dispute) is maligned by your rudeness and your threats, when the most I > needed from you was your gentle reminder that my sarcastic one liners do not > in fact help anybody's cause. > I am at least two people - one of them wants simply to apologise and promise > to try never to do something of the kind again, while the other is possessed > by the need to assert that this is not because of being threatened. The > anger which you hold makes resolution of this dichotomy impossible for me. > You say that I have no right to be angry about the kind of post that > initiated this thread, but I am not. I don't think you actually mean "right" > here but, in any case, it is not anger that I have felt or feel now. Rather > is there here another human who has his own life experience (clearly very > much longer than yours, as it happens), and for whom the issue is rather one > of hurt. And this human feels he has every "right" to be hurt - by the > original poster, by your intemperate words, by your bullying behaviour. > I have no clear idea as to why you think you will improve a situation by > using threats and offensive language but doing so is your choice, just as it > is my choice to continue to discuss the matter in spite of my risking being > banned by doing so. I don't want to be banned, but neither do I want you or > anyone else to think that I accept your threats as a valid basis for my > behaviour choices. > My closing position is that you are right that my action was childish (I > believe I was the first to say so) and you are also right that I have erred > in similar style in the past (which fact may indicate a personality defect > similar to your own, although I believe we differ on which is actually > poisonous). You are not right to bully or threaten me, not least because to > do so is as ineffective and pointless as my childish remarks, and > contradicts your own exhortation to be a nice person too. > I have already apologised for causing the upset - I do so again now, without > reservation. I will not enter into any contract not to fail in the same > manner again as long as my doing so is conditioned by fear of the result, > nor is there any need for me to do so since I have at no time attempted to > justify this kind of action anyway and wouldn't perform it if I thought > first. Your threats are empty, not because you won't carry them out but > because they cannot achieve your purpose. > If I have anything further to add to the thread, I will do so direct to > yourself - notwithstanding that you have warned me against doing that too. > Anyhow, it's late for Eid and early for Thanksgiving - tomorrow is the > Birthday of the Bab so I wish all readers the most sincere greetings for > that. > Nick out… > > On 19 Oct 2010, at 00:30, Christopher Forsythe wrote: > > Every time I started to type this email, I found myself not being able > to complete it, so I stepped away. I think you aren't reading what I'm > saying how I'm thinking it in my head, so I'm going to reiterate it in > a different manner. After this, this thread needs to die. If you are > confused, reread this. I will be as clear here as I am ever going to > be. > > When I thought about what kind of user you are to our community. I > came to the conclusion that you are verging on being a poisonous > person. Please see > http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4216011961522818645# if you > have not seen it already, it's an excellent talk about the type of > person I think you are verging on becoming. > > The reason I say this is due to a pattern in responses which have no > value, other than to be annoying. Here is a small list I found by just > searching for about 3 minutes, I stopped looking once I hit 4 emails: > > http://groups.google.com/group/growldiscuss/msg/a19a2ff6a84ebdd8 > http://groups.google.com/group/growldiscuss/msg/872c304048d33e0a > http://groups.google.com/group/growldiscuss/msg/74b285e15eb9ebf2 > http://groups.google.com/group/growldiscuss/msg/be17f47730a0cc5f > > Some common themes here are: > > - Lack of useful responses > - Sarcasm verging on starting a heated discussion on a thread > - Short responses > > This all said, you do provide some great feedback.When I found you > provided the best feedback it was about your specific problems though. > > You responded to this user first. The user does not have a way to > differentiate who represents the project, and who is merely a member > of this mailing list/discussion group. As such, you represented this > entire group. You did so in a very sarcastic manner, with none of the > following: > > - No quality control. > - No useful information to help the end user > - No helping at all > > > All of this to what end? No good one as far as I'm concerned. So no, I > do not believe you were wishing him a Merry Christmas. I know you were > in fact being a prick. Which is why I'm angry at you. You basically > just gave us a worse name to this user than we already had to him. > Which isn't a good place for us to be in, seeing how this can all be > avoided very easily. > > Now, instead, you could have taken these actions, and not come across > as someone who is simply out to make himself feel good for 2 seconds > for a childish act: > > - Responded with the link to the article about this issue > - Responded saying you understand, and providing details about how > dropbox is actually doing this, and then how to remove Growl > - Not responded at all > > These 3 responses at the very least would have been more beneficial > than the response you chose to make. > > Since you decided to send your sarcastic email to the list publicly, I > decided to reprimand you publicly. I will reiterate what I said > earlier. Do not respond to end users in this manner. They do not > deserve to be treated like this. We don't either, but their anger is > just, only not justly directed. You however have no right to be angry > about it, since it is not affecting you at all. > > I spent more time today thinking about this one thing than anything > else. I have a six month old son who is better behaved than you are on > this list. I'm not going to sit here and baby sit you, you need to be > an adult here. I also want this thread to end, unless the original > poster requires more assistance. However, since this thread was > derailed, I've already started a direct email with him so he doesn't > have to continue to deal with this. > > I have concluded that this is not acceptable behavior to tolerate for > these issues. If you respond to another user in a sarcastic manner > such as this, I will ban you. If you continue to make me have to > respond to you after being very clear in this email, I will also ban > you. If you choose to email me or any other member of the Growl > project directly to complain about this, I will ban you. Basically, > drop the issue, move on, and don't be a prick in the future, and we're > all set. > > As far as I'm concerned, this should not have been how this user was > handled. You made us look bad. You need to own up to that, and learn > from it. I don't want to think about it anymore. > > > -- > > Nicholas J A Sanders > ___________________ > semiotek > > +44 [0]7092 153 409 > [email protected] > ___________________ > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Growl Discuss" group. > To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > [email protected]. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/growldiscuss?hl=en. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Growl Discuss" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected]. 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