I just wish, although I freely admit there could be something I missed,
that there was a wato change the way TB reads message headers. It reads
subject first then sender and I'd prefer to have it do it the other wayy
around. A small gripbe but that's ust how I've gotten used to it over
the years. Again there could be a way to do this in one of the menus and
I've just been missing it. LOL.
But thou must!
On 5/9/2013 7:36 PM, Rod Hutton wrote:
Hi Evan,
Thunderbird is totally free. I was just blowing my horn about how
everyone expects Microsoft to give away free perfectly-accessible
software. That's all I was babbling about. Smile. Sorry for the
miscommunication.
The URL to the :Thunderbird faq is
https://support.mozillamessaging.com/en-US/kb/thunderbird-faq
Let me know if I can help more. Smile.
Take care,
Rod
On 5/09/13 8:14 PM, Evan Reese wrote:
Hi Rod,
I've heard a lot of good things about Thunderbird. I also know
there's an app for it. I wasn't aware that it cost. If it's not too
expensive, I'll consider ditching Windows Mail for it. How much is it?
Thanks much.
Evan
----- Original Message ----- From: "Rod Hutton" <[email protected]>
To: "Evan Reese" <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, May 09, 2013 7:17 PM
Subject: Re: WE 8.2 IE 10 and the mouse.
Hi Evan,
The thing is, going back to earlier versions of WE and XP, Outlook
Express was a crap-shoot when it came to accessibility. I'm finding
Thunderbird with WE 8.2 much more consistent, not to mention that TB
has more features than Outlook Express and Windows Live Mail. I
can't say much about Windows Mail, since I Never used it.
I'm only knocking the free MS mail software because they are free,
like the Mozilla products, and people seem to have a sense of
entitlement about Windows, i.e., they expect MS to give them
perfectly accessible products for free. As for Outlook, the e-mail
client which is part of the Office suite, people seem to have much
fewer ongoing fundamental accessibility issues with it. Ah, yes,
but it's not free. Smile. I say that if you're going to go for
free, the price might be frustration. Of course, I'm never so bold
as to say that payment is any guarantee against suffering. However,
if you do pay for something, you're entitled to scream louder when
it doesn't perform as expected. Smile. Of course, one needs to add
the caveat that we are talking about the PC world, where all the
rules are regularly broken. Smile.
With the greatest respect, and some healthy teasing,
Rod
On 5/09/13 1:35 PM, Evan Reese wrote:
Hi Rod,
You make some very good points here. I agree that GW's method of
allowing apps is much better than that of the competition. I would
also mention that I will always be grateful to GW Micro for
creating the LTO program.
However, by saying that you are "not surprised" that it's a free
email client from Microsoft that I'm having trouble with you seem
to imply that it's Microsoft's fault. That is a bit unfair. It was
not Windows Mail that changed, but the version of Window Eyes I was
using.
Evan
----- Original Message ----- From: "Rod Hutton" <[email protected]>
To: "Evan Reese" <[email protected]>; "gwi >> gw-info"
<[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, May 08, 2013 11:27 PM
Subject: Re: WE 8.2 IE 10 and the mouse.
Hi Evan,
Why am I not surprised that it's a free e-mail client from
Microsoft you're having trouble with. Ironically, on my Windows 7
x64 Home Premium system, I just got fed up with Windows Live Mail
and switched to the far-more-reliable Mozilla Thunderbird. I do
believe GW Micro is doing their utmost to keep up with the
ever-changing software landscape, and I would rather change any
software on my system rather than my faithful Window-Eyes. For
example, I designed a calendar program myself which just speaks my
appointments from day to day. This was not possible for me until
GW Micro made a scripting interface for Window-Eyes. The
improvement to my quality of life provided by the scripts I have
learned to write,, making use of the Window-Eyes object model, has
convinced me that GW Micro is at the top of the screen-reader
tree. I do believe that it comes down to whether customers trust
the competence of the designers of their accessibility software.
I sincerely respect GW Micro for exposing the guts of Window-Eyes
such that specific apps can be designed to make all kinds of
software accessible, not just the ones which come in the box
bundled with Windows. In truth, the future of accessibility for
people of all disabilities would be much brighter if software
designers thought like GW Micro did when they offered programmers
their object model to work with.
Finally, because of the possibility of writing scripts to help
make software more accessible, as well as the fact that we have a
discussion group like this e-mail list, we have the tools at our
disposal to help all of us enjoy a better quality of life.
Therefore, my advice to everyone is this: ask questions, make
suggestions, but for heaven's sake let us not lead with negative
criticism. We can all get what we need. If we haven't learned it
yet, the key is patience. It's not something which comes easy to
any of us, but, we need it in order to survive, especially in a
world where most people don't have visible disabilities.
With the greatest respect, not to mention a good helping of gutsy
attitude,
Rod
On 5/08/13 10:09 PM, Evan Reese wrote:
Well, in my case, I'm using Vista Home Premium and Windows Mail.
In the last several versions of WE, I have to go into edit mode
to compose messages in it. If I alt-tab away from the program for
whatever reason in the middle of a message, then return, I have
to go back into edit mode and find my place in the message before
I can continue to write. Also, if I select multiple words or
sentences in a message and try to delete them, WE freezes up and
I usually have to reboot the computer to get it back. Sometimes
We returns if I wait a few minutes, sometimes not. I never had
any of this trouble with version 7.2. My email worked perfectly.
I was slow to upgrade from 7.2, so when I finally did, I went
directly from version 7.2 to version 7.5.4.1. So I can't say if
the trouble would have started at 7.5 or not, but I suspect that
it would have if I had stopped there, since that is when some
major changes were introduced. I was told that this issue was
fixed with version 8.0, but I am still having the problem with
8.2. I called GW about this back at 8.0 and was asked to send in
a diagnostic, which I did, back in December or January. Not sure
exactly just now, but it's been several months at least. Never
heard anything back. Since I use my email program every day, this
is a pretty major annoyance. And since I do use it every day,
every day I wish I had just left my computer alone when it was
working fine.
So there is a concrete example for you.
Evan
----- Original Message ----- From: "Rod Hutton"
<[email protected]>
To: "Evan Reese" <[email protected]>; "gwi >> gw-info"
<[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, May 08, 2013 9:27 PM
Subject: Re: WE 8.2 IE 10 and the mouse.
Hi,
If you are having trouble with 8.2, it is my opinion that it can
be configured to operate the way previous versions worked. I
have seen some keyboard reassignments, but have not seen
fundamental changes in its ability to access Windows software.
If I'm wrong, let's have some concrete examples.
Cordially,
Rod
On 5/08/13 9:08 PM, Evan Reese wrote:
I would also agree that I had very little trouble with version
7.2, much less than I do now. Any way to go back to it from
8.2? I've got the LTO executable of 7.2 here, but I've paid it
off since then, so I don't have the straight non-LTO version.
Is there any way to revert to 7.2?
Evan
----- Original Message ----- From: "Trenton Matthews"
<[email protected]>
To: "Olusegun -- Victory Associates LTD, Inc."
<[email protected]>
Cc: "Gwmicro gw-info mail list" <[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, May 08, 2013 8:06 PM
Subject: Re: WE 8.2 IE 10 and the mouse.
I have to agree, version 7.2 was honestly the best! version of
WE to date.
Nothing can top that one!
It just, well, worked!
Honestly, Firefox 3.6.28, is still the best with WE, least for
me.
Not saying that it doesn't work with the latest versions, but
there's
just many things it worked better with back in the day.
On 5/8/13, Olusegun -- Victory Associates LTD, Inc.
<[email protected]> wrote:
Hi Sandra:
I think you might be better off waiting for Window-Eyes to
get cleaned up
some more before upgrading at work. I work for myself and,
because I submit
claims via a state web portal for adjudication, I can't use
FireFox either.
Fortunately for me though, I run three versions of
Window-Eyes at work--7.2,
7.5.4.1 and 8.2. The first two are on two separate computers
in my back
office. I swear that Window-Eyes 7.2 boots up a lot faster
than the other
two incarnations. It is what I use in my back office 99% of
the time. And
since I am still running Windows XP Professional Service
Pak3, I use
Internet Explorer 8. I am in fact thinking of downgrading it
to Internet
Explorer 7.
At home on a Windows7 Professional laptop computer running
Internet Explorer
10, the story is NOT A PRETTY ONE with Window-Eyes 8.2. I
now plan to
install NVDA on this machine and try to give it a test drive.
I've not
renewed the SMA for Window-Eyes for the reasons everyone
seems to be
grappling with. May be when we get to Version 10xxxxx--and I
want to avoid
HAVING TO PAY for CUMULATIVE UPGRADES--Window-Eyes will
become what it was
several moons back.
Sincerely,
Olusegun
Denver, Colorado
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If you reply to this message it will be delivered to the original
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can manage your list subscription at http://www.gwmicro.com/listserv.
If you reply to this message it will be delivered to the original sender only.
If your reply would benefit others on the list and your message is related to
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