I don't think it's disrespect. I'm sure gw works real hard in what they do. Some people don't want to put out more money when there is free product that does what need. -----Original Message----- From: Tom Kingston [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Monday, June 17, 2013 12:50 PM To: Gwmicro gw-info mail list Subject: Re: WE and NVDA
Congratulations. I'm glad you're proud of your complete disrespect for the hard work and support of the GW-Micro staff. You should be on the other end of the stick to get a taste of the real world. Tom On 6/17/2013 1:31 PM, Morné van der Merwe wrote: Chris, well said. This is also my last sma. -----Original Message----- From: Peter Beasley [ mailto:[email protected] ] Sent: 17 June 2013 07:07 PM To: Chris H; [email protected] ; Kevin Barry Subject: Re: WE and NVDA I second what Chris said. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kevin Barry" <[email protected]> To: "Chris H" <[email protected]> ; <[email protected]> Sent: Monday, June 17, 2013 5:49 PM Subject: Re: WE and NVDA If this is your opinion please have the minimum level of class necessary to be considered civilized and keep it off the GW list. At 12:33 PM 6/17/2013, Chris H wrote: Well, trying not to offend Gw Micro, I would say do not bother. Nvda has come on leaps and bounds since its inception, and many, many users are using it as their prefered screen reader, even though they have the commercial ones installed. This is actually my set up. Although I have an Sma for Window-Eyes, I do not think I will be renewing it at the appropriate time. Chris On 17/06/2013 14:32, Morné van der Merwe wrote: Well, I'm seriously wondering if I must pay for an upgrade of WE next year. If NVDA makes such progress. *From:*David [ mailto:[email protected] ] *Sent:* 17 June 2013 12:57 PM *To:* WE English mailing list *Subject:* WE and NVDA In late May, GW released the locale version of WE8.2, in my region. Great news, since I finally could start to benefit from the upgrades that came in the 8-series of the screen reader. And, it also meant, that I now could bring out my new machine - which unfortunately has Windows8 installed. Yet, I have to say, the joy was somehow mixed, and has been so for the last few weeks. I now hope that someone can tell me what I am to change for settings. First thing I do notice, is that the set files do not always load automatically. For instance, it took a while, before I realized that the newly - all fresh - installation of WE8.2, did not load the Firefox set file automatically, when I opened Firefox. I then went through the process of manually loading and associating the set file with Firefox. Seems to work OK now, but still wonder why this did not happen automatically in a brand new installation. Yesterday, I decided to register my new PC, with HP. This is a fairly easy process, since the HP machine comes with a pre-installed piece of software. Running this software, up comes two consequtive screens, holding edit boxes that you need to fill in. The boxes are quite a standard form version, asking your first- and lastname, along with your contact info. But with WE loaded, there was simply NO chance - whatsoever. The first field on the screen asked my firstname, but landing my cursor on it, WE would read to me the "Submit"-label, which is the last bottom line button of the screen. Tabbing once, landing on the field for my lastname, WE reported that this field was for my Email, which actually was the third field of the screen. If I tabbed and shift-tabbed back and forth on the screen, WE would read the labels of fields that would be two or three fields away from the actual one I was focusing. This even if I tabbed very slowly through the form. OK, I thought, Yet another one of th ose totally inaccessible screens we so often are presented with. But I have come to learn, not to stop there. So I loaded NVDA. Guess you all have grasped the end of the story already. Sure thing, NVDA did read the fields of that form - totally correctly - and exactly as you would have expected. It was the matter of less than thirty seconds to fill in the form and have it submitted, with NVDA loaded. I even tested things, running both NVDA and WE simultaneously, to see the difference in behavior. NVDA kept steadily reading the field-tags correctly, While WE just as stubbornly kept reading the tags arbitrarily. If I give my computer a cold-start, I can hit the Win-D and get to the desktop. WE will now read the different items of my desktop, as I move up and down. If I leave the desktop - for instance by loading Firefox >from the desktop - and then return by hitting Win-D, all I hear from WE is "No Item Selected, List". Loading NVDA, I can leave and return to the desktop as much as I like, and I will hear the items on the desktop read out to me. Why not with WE? Why all this stuff about "no item selected", which isn't even true, since the current item is being focused and selected. I know it is, because NVDA reports it to be, and I can hit Enter, and the attached software starts. This doesn't seem much reliable to me, for the part of Window-Eyes. Sometimes, when starting a software, you get up the safety screen asking if you will permit this software to make changes on your computer. When this screen comes up, NVDA will read it, but WE does go quietly dead. The Eloquence of WE, will not start to speak again, until you have made your choice in this safety screen. Not even if you Alt-Tab to another screen or software. As I said, NVDA reads the safety screen just fine. Other times, some background software - like a security scan - will pop-up a message on the screen. If this message in any way conflicts WE, things like the mouse-keys of WE, stop to work. They keep dinging at you. Alt-Tabbing through the list of software, does give you no clue. And, window-eyes did not inform you that a background message had popped up on the screen. In many cases, I have noticed that NVDA does work far more smoothly with these cases. More and more, I find myself having to load NVDA several times aday, just to perform even plain tasks, like choosing a software from off the desktop. After having paid the upgrade price for Window-Eyes 8.2, I really don't feel this should have been necessary. WE is being claimed to be a stabil and solid screen reader, and it does cost several hundred dollars. Then I also feel we are in our rights, to expect it to do its job. But when you cannot even read the info on the desktop, or have speech through the vital parts of the security screens, I really question the reliability of the screen reader. My hope now, is that someone out there has a workaround for these issues. Maybe some setting I have to change, so as to have things working properly. Further, I hope that such workarounds will be included in upcoming shippings of the screen reader. As it stands today, it definitely was no "right-out-of-the-box" experience to install and run WE. Finally, GW, why do you automatically load all those apps that ship with the screen reader. OK, most of them, I can see will be helpful. But the ones that are shipping, and which are supposed to make the jump from things like Jaws easier. For most of us, this kind of apps are only in our way, since they do change certain keystrokes. Why not have a checkbox in the installation process, that would tell if I am migrating >from Jaws. If I check this box, which by standard could be unchecked, these extra apps wil be installed. Same thing goes with the quickstart app, which I think could do its job in setting things up, and then be deactivated. Just some ideas... If you reply to this message it will be delivered to the original sender only. If your reply would benefit others on the list and your message is related to GW Micro, then please consider sending your message to [email protected] so the entire list will receive it. GW-Info messages are archived at http://www.gwmicro.com/gwinfo ... You can manage your list subscription at http://www.gwmicro.com/listserv ... If you reply to this message it will be delivered to the original sender only. If your reply would benefit others on the list and your message is related to GW Micro, then please consider sending your message to [email protected] so the entire list will receive it. GW-Info messages are archived at http://www.gwmicro.com/gwinfo ... You can manage your list subscription at http://www.gwmicro.com/listserv ... If you reply to this message it will be delivered to the original sender only. If your reply would benefit others on the list and your message is related to GW Micro, then please consider sending your message to [email protected] so the entire list will receive it. GW-Info messages are archived at http://www.gwmicro.com/gwinfo ... You can manage your list subscription at http://www.gwmicro.com/listserv ... If you reply to this message it will be delivered to the original sender only. If your reply would benefit others on the list and your message is related to GW Micro, then please consider sending your message to [email protected] so the entire list will receive it. GW-Info messages are archived at http://www.gwmicro.com/gwinfo ... You can manage your list subscription at http://www.gwmicro.com/listserv .. If you reply to this message it will be delivered to the original sender only. If your reply would benefit others on the list and your message is related to GW Micro, then please consider sending your message to [email protected] so the entire list will receive it. GW-Info messages are archived at http://www.gwmicro.com/gwinfo. You can manage your list subscription at http://www.gwmicro.com/listserv. If you reply to this message it will be delivered to the original sender only. If your reply would benefit others on the list and your message is related to GW Micro, then please consider sending your message to [email protected] so the entire list will receive it. GW-Info messages are archived at http://www.gwmicro.com/gwinfo. You can manage your list subscription at http://www.gwmicro.com/listserv.
